GC extended OCI in VW Sludgemonster?

Messages
17
Location
Eastern Seaboard, US
Hi all, First ever post, and definitely succumbed to the Elvish ways. Though late to the Green party, finally put in Gold GC into both 1.8T Passats we own. These AEB engines are notorious for sludge issues. I was wondering though about extending the OCI for they are also notorious for PITA OCs. Should I stick with the 5K miles requirement by VW? One vehicle is still under sludge warranty, 76K miles, and the other is not at 132K miles (and ARX'd). I'm planning on doing UOAs for both cars, but if I'm to do extended OCIs, where should I start? IOW, 5K, 6K, or greater than 7K? Anybody have a max OCI for these engines? Thanks all!
 
Messages
7,550
Location
North Alabama
From a fellow VW 1.8T owner, here's my $.02+9/10 DON'T DO EXTENDED OCI's ON THOSE PASSATS! YOU WOULD ONLY BE ASKING FOR TROUBLE, IMHO. Stick with 5-6k miles OCI's. OK, I feel better now. Oh by the way, [Welcome!] to BITOG.
 

flipb5

Thread starter
Messages
17
Location
Eastern Seaboard, US
Noob question coming: even synthetics sludge (as great as GC is)? That's what I was wondering about most. OK, staying with the 5K OCI and getting an oil extractor. Yesterday while I changed the oil on rhino ramps, I cracked one! The ramp slid when I was putting the car up, and a big crack opened up in front! Didn't even notice it until my skull was underneath the car. I've already ARXd the older car, and plan on doing it on both cars in the spring. Maintenance dose on the older car in the meantime. I just started looking into LC. What benefits can I expect from it? Is it better than ARX? Or should I use it in conjunction? BITOG is amazing. I've learned more than I really want to know about oil in my cars... [Big Grin] Thanks again! I may do UOAs on the cars just to see how the cars take to GC...
 
Messages
7,550
Location
North Alabama
quote:
Originally posted by flipb5: Noob question coming: even synthetics sludge (as great as GC is)?....
Any oil will sludge, if you leave it in for too long.
 
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2,493
Location
MSP 'burbs, MN
[Off Topic!]
quote:
Originally posted by flipb5: Yesterday while I changed the oil on rhino ramps, I cracked one! The ramp slid when I was putting the car up, and a big crack opened up in front! Didn't even notice it until my skull was underneath the car.
Get in touch with the company and I bet you'll get a replacement set of ramps under warranty. I've heard the company (Blitz I think) has very good customer service.
 
Messages
1,116
Location
Huntsville, AL
Find out what Audi's OCI is using a 503.01 oil (which GC is) in the A4 wih the same engine. That spec was created for extended OCI's in hi horse turbo motors, so I bet you would be safe to go 8-10k. If an oil doesnt' have VW 503.01, but only the VW 502, 5k would be the limit.
 
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5,358
Location
Gone
The Elves wish to inform everyone that GC does NOT sludge; if you leave it in longer than you should it merely increases in...um-m-m-m...character.
 
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23,591
quote:
If an oil doesnt' have VW 503.01, but only the VW 502, 5k would be the limit.
Show me where VW says that, please.
 
Messages
1,116
Location
Huntsville, AL
I have in my hand "Approved Engine Oils for Audis" and on the sidebar it lists 'Volkswagen group oil specifications and their application'. I'm not sure where I printed this from but I think Audi Junkie posted the link a while back. This is what it says- 502 - This oil can only be used in petrol engines and is recommended for those which are subject to arduous conditions. It must not be used for any engines with variable service intervals or any which are referred to under other specifications. Viscosity ratings - SAE 0w-40, 5w-40, or 10w-40. 503.00 - This is a new oil spec for petrol engines with variable service intervals. It includes the Audi S4, but not the RS4, or the TT and S3 with outputs of more than 180bhp. SAE 0w-30 503.01 - A new oil spec specifically for the RS4, and the TT and S3 with outputs of more than 180bhp, Passat W8 and Phaeton W12. SAE 0w-30 If you go to the VW/Audi dealer they will be (or should be) using the Castrol 5w-40, VW502 oil in Passats every 5k and the Castrol 0w-30 VW503.01 every 8 or 10k in the A4's. They have the same turbo 4. [ October 31, 2005, 11:08 PM: Message edited by: glxpassat ]
 
Messages
716
Location
San Gabriel Valley
quote:
Originally posted by glxpassat: 503.01 - A new oil spec specifically for the RS4, and the TT and S3 with outputs of more than 180bhp, Passat W8 and Phaeton W12. SAE 0w-30 If you go to the VW/Audi dealer they will be (or should be) using the Castrol 5w-40, VW502 oil in Passats every 5k and the Castrol 0w-30 VW503.01 every 8 or 10k in the A4's. They have the same turbo 4.
Hhmm..so my Motul 8100 E-Tech 0w40 can do an 8-10k oci then for my Passat ATW 1.8T. It has both the VW 502.00 and VW 503.01 blessings. Though I now run 5qts GC 0w30(strict 4.7-5k ocis) w/ a Mannolator..the 12ltr stash of E-Tech is under lock-n-key. [Smile]
 

JAG

Messages
5,320
Location
Fredericksburg, VA
I agree with Wayne. It may do fine with longer OCIs than 5k, but in your engine/car, the risk outweighs the slight cost savings that will provide...and if you have a problem and do long OCIs, VW won't honor your warranty on your younger car if sludge does occur. I don't think UOAs will decisively tell you if sludging is occuring either. Once that oil pickup screen is sludged, the oil pressure/flow is choked and the engine starves/dies. Best way to check for sludge is to pull the oil pan and inspect.
 
Messages
113
Location
appalachia
Stick with the 5k oil changes. If you have a true sludge problem. I.E. not just varnish, then proceed carefully with some type of engine cleaner. It will require removal of the oil pan to access the oil pan, clean and clean the oil screen. Dicy territory there. There is nothing magic about GC regarding sludge. I would not see it as a "anti-sluge" oil for sure. Use the big filter [I dont know] . I would also increase the OCI if I had a sludge or varnish issue.
 
Messages
142
Location
Atlanta
If I had a 1.8T I wouldn't go more than 5K, and would always use LC or ARX maintenance. Spend $40 and get an oil extractor and your passat becomes one of the easiest and fastest OCs around.
 
Messages
23,591
quote:
502 - This oil can only be used in petrol engines and is recommended for those which are subject to arduous conditions. It must not be used for any engines with variable service intervals or any which are referred to under other specifications. Viscosity ratings - SAE 0w-40, 5w-40, or 10w-40.
Well, that's not quite correct. VW 502 may very well be used in engines with variable service interval displays, if those displays are ignored and regular oil change intervals are maintained. [Wink] Whether VW 503.01 is "better" than VW 502.00 is a highly questionable claim that keeps being made. Approved VW 502 viscosities are not limited to the ones mentioned, but also include 0W-30, 5W-30, 5W-50, 10W-30, 10W-50, 10W-60, 15W-40, 15W-50, 20W-40 and 20W-50. As ACEA A3-rated oils, all VW 502.00 oils are suitable for extended drain, only not to the same degree as VW 503.01-rated oils in vehicles with the flexible service interval display (which may not even be available in US models). Also, VW does not specify VW 503.01 oil in any engines other than VR5, VR6, W8 and W12. That spec is being used only for Audi engines. The mentioned VW 503.00 low HTHS spec was never applicable in ANY US VW or Audi model. This spec is also disappearing and being replaced by VW 504/507, along with most other VW oil specs. http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y108/moribundman/500501505502.jpg http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y108/moribundman/vw503.jpg http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y108/moribundman/vw_oil.jpg http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y108/moribundman/audi_oil.jpg
 
Messages
1,116
Location
Huntsville, AL
quote:
Whether VW 503.01 is "better" than VW 502.00 is a highly questionable claim that keeps being made.
We know that some oils that are group 3 meet the 502 spec but we know that GC and mobil-1 0w-40 that meet the 503.01 are pao. So in my mind 503.01 is better, especially when it costs the same amount.
 

JAG

Messages
5,320
Location
Fredericksburg, VA
Yes, I did not mean to insult the Elves by suggesting only a 5k interval. I merely wanted this guy to be able to maintain his sludge warranty which VW/Audi so graciously provide for the longitudinal 1.8T IF he uses 5k intervals and uses a 502 spec oil such as GC. It indeed takes some horrible punishment for GC to sludge.
 

flipb5

Thread starter
Messages
17
Location
Eastern Seaboard, US
Wow, I love how the word "sludge" nets so many responses! In terms of the VW sludge warranty, it is 8 years starting from the in-service date of the vehicle. So my '98 still has 14 months remaining and my GFs 99 variant is almost two years. So I will keep strict 5K OCIs until the warranty lapses. After that, uh, maybe venture out deeper into Elvish country? Not quite as far as 19K, though! Thanks all again for the continuing posts, much food for thought!
 
Messages
23,591
quote:
We know that some oils that are group 3 meet the 502 spec but we know that GC and mobil-1 0w-40 that meet the 503.01 are pao. So in my mind 503.01 is better, especially when it costs the same amount.
Well, are all oils that meet VW 503.01 only Group IV and possibly some Group V, or are some VW 503.01 oils Group III (with possibly some Group IV or Group V) in it? By the way, I'd really like to know if any US import VW and Audi vehicles have by now the flexible service interval display and if they are equipped for LL service. I keep asking this question and nobody ever answers it.
 
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