freakin saturn, I give up
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Sounds like you researched this well. I'm nearly at the end of similar with my turbo. Good luck!
I have a 93 SL1 with 163,000 on her, with the same oil loosing/burning habit. Sounds like the Auto rx will be more costly for me in the long run, but I sure hope it works for you Matt.
Could anyone post some links, or other info that talks specifically about this oil related problem with the Saturns? This is new to me, but would like to know more about it. I really like my Saturn, and have friends who do also, and the info may help me make future buying decisions.
Thanks
Jay
quote:There is a Saturn-specific site that a lot of us go to -- I'm not sure if I can/should give the URL here -- but if you want to PM me I can give you the address. You can do a search for oil burning there, and find a gazillion posts about it. The long and short of it is, the pistons in the 1.9 engines lack adequate oil drainage around the ring pack. I'm not sure if they lack any drain holes at all, or if there are too few or they are too small. Basically, oil that gets in there can't get out and bakes onto the rings -- even synthetic oil. A lot of Saturn owners have torn down their engines only to find everything looking perfect as the day it rolled off the assembly line, except for stuck, blackened, frozen piston rings. Most cleaners that you add to your crankcase don't do much good with this for the same reason the oil bakes on the rings in the first place: if it gets to the rings, it likely bakes on (or burns off) before it has a chance to do any kind of cleaning. Some have had good luck with Auto-RX. Personally, I've tried that and a whole host of other things with no success. I recently tried the B-12 piston soak recommended by Dragboat (one application only, with none left in the crankcase), and my burning seems to have slowed somewhat, but not much. This is with 155,000 miles on the clock, nothing but synthetic oil every 3000 miles since break-in.
Originally posted by Jay M: I have a 93 SL1 with 163,000 on her, with the same oil loosing/burning habit. Sounds like the Auto rx will be more costly for me in the long run, but I sure hope it works for you Matt. Could anyone post some links, or other info that talks specifically about this oil related problem with the Saturns? This is new to me, but would like to know more about it. I really like my Saturn, and have friends who do also, and the info may help me make future buying decisions. Thanks Jay
Hmm, any Saturn drivers ever tried Red Line oils? ![[Wink]](images/icons/wink.gif)
quote:I wonder if Saturn owners ran a regular maintainence dose of a cleaner such as Auto-Rx or Neutra before the problem becomes Chronic if it could solve the problem for the life of the car. My feeling is if you run with stuck rings for long enough, it causes excessive wear, and then you can't fix the problem by unsticking the rings. In your case maybe the engine is just worn out. Have you done compression checks? [ January 08, 2003, 11:51 AM: Message edited by: Giles ]
Originally posted by kev99sl: Some have had good luck with Auto-RX. Personally, I've tried that and a whole host of other things with no success. I recently tried the B-12 piston soak recommended by Dragboat (one application only, with none left in the crankcase), and my burning seems to have slowed somewhat, but not much. This is with 155,000 miles on the clock, nothing but synthetic oil every 3000 miles since break-in.
I meant after it was cleaned up or before it builds up.
Better high temp performance. Hopefully with little to no buildup. Sure would be interesting result. I know I would be running it if I had one.
Jason, It sounds like to me the Saturn's have a problem that motor oil can't solve by itself. Oil cannot fix an inferior design or mechanical problems. I doubt Redline would change the results much, however it would be interesting to see if these engines were treated with a cleaner at regular intervals if it could make a difference.
Patman
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Well now I'm completely convinced to never buy a Saturn for my wife! ![[Thumbs Down!]](/forums/graemlins/thumbsdown.gif)
quote:] The 2003's have the Ecotec motor,,time will tell is they are any good or not but they sound and run like little sewing machines when new. This is sure a long thread < Yawn >
Originally posted by Patman: Well now I'm completely convinced to never buy a Saturn for my wife!
quote:]
Originally posted by dragboat: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Patman: [qb]Well now I'm completely convinced to never buy a Saturn for my wife!
![[Off Topic!]](/forums/graemlins/offtopic.gif)
The 2003's have the Ecotec motor,,time will tell if they are any good or not but they sound and run like little sewing machines when new. They have a 5 quart sump to boot!
[ January 08, 2003, 05:01 PM: Message edited by: dragboat ]quote:Well, this is going to sound really rich after all my bellyaching about the engine in this car, but honestly it's been one of the best cars I've ever owned! I've had it for 4 years, and have put over 155,000 miles on it with not a single problem ... except the oil burning. A lot of people are driving around in 8-year-old Saturns, burning 4 quarts between changes, with well over 200,000 miles, and all emission tests passed. I don't get it either, but it's the truth. My Toyota Tercel's engine gave up the ghost at 130,000 miles, while my Saturn drives with the same performance it ever did, and only a couple MPG less than right after it was broken in. It's a weird thing...
Originally posted by Patman: Well now I'm completely convinced to never buy a Saturn for my wife!
quote:The most I've let it drop is to just 1/10th of a quart left on the dipstick. We're all too scared to let it get even that low for fear of starving the timing chain.
Originally posted by dragboat: Has a Saturn owner when a 3/4 to 1 quart low just left it there without topping off to see if the oil level dropped further or just stayed put for awhile ??
Just had to ask "what is a Saturn"
GM had such a poor record of making small cars in the U. S. that they created a new division, Saturn, new factory, new dealerships, and invented new cars with new design engines. I think the hope was that GM's other U.S. brands would learn from Saturn. I don't think that the Saturn division has ever earned a profit. (If they wanted to build good small cars, why didn't they just build a complete Opel factory, exact copy of an Opel factory in Germany, and then name these carbon-copy Opels Saturn, or Venus, or Uranus, or whatever?)
The dealerships are good, probably among the lowest B.S. factor.
The cars are consistently mediocre, don't look like much to my eye, and the engines could be better...GM engine designers sure should'a known how to design pistons with adequate oil drains or whatever the problem is.
http://www.saturn.com/
Ken
[ January 08, 2003, 06:07 PM: Message edited by: Ken2 ]
Just a scattered datapoint. My wife's 97 Saturn SL1 has 80K miles and didn't use a drop of 5W-30 dino oil, Mobil 1, or AMSOIL 5W-30.
I'm still confused about this engine -- is there seal leakage and oil burning? Or are we thinking there's oil burning and trying to fix that so we don't have to change a seal?
Andy
Ken, Aren't the Saturn's basically rebadged Euro Opels?
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