Fram Extended Guard *cut open* (unused)

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Originally Posted By: Spyder7
It also holds a lot of "dirt." Double the dirt average of Fram's own OCOD. FRAM® Xtended Guard™ Oil Filter: Our Ultimate Engine Protection * Specially engineered filtering media arranged in two plies and reinforced with a metal screen to deliver up to 10,000 miles of engine protection.1 * Traps and holds more than double the dirt of leading economy oil filter brands' average.2 * 97% Dirt Trapping Efficiency2 * Silicone anti-drainback valve holds a reserve of oil in the filter to help protect the engine during start-ups I've been thinking about picking one up to attach to my vacuum. -Spyder
I dont understand your deal, the stupid marketing terms they use dont change how good the filter is. here is an example, if m1 put on there box that their filter is designed to "catch 99% of stuff" instead of "trap 99% contaminents" would it affect how good the filter preforms? i think not
 
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Originally Posted By: Spyder7
I don't use them. Not a knock against the XG (despite having some fun with the way Fram advertises it), but the cost difference for me between the XG and the M1 EP is so small that I just go with the Mobil. As the Mobil is more expensive, its up to others if its worth the extra cost over the XG. Contrary to what the OP posted, the M1 EP is not "a paper filter." The cost of both are a little higher for me, though I don't feel "stupid" when I buy it. Its expensive, yes, but I think you get what you for. -Spyder
$4 - $5 is alot considering the price of oil filters, that is like buying a car for 13,000 dollars when you could buy an equally good car made with better materials for 9,000 dollars, obviously you fall for the "if something is more expensive it must be better" deal.
 
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Extended Guard is the only fram I'll use. I've got one on my bro's grand am with a fill of M1 EP. Gonna take a UOA around 12k miles. And another is on my dad's caravan with a fill of Rotella T6, gonna take a UOA of it too around 12k miles.
 
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Originally Posted By: trabuccomlfrd
Originally Posted By: Spyder7
I don't use them. Not a knock against the XG (despite having some fun with the way Fram advertises it), but the cost difference for me between the XG and the M1 EP is so small that I just go with the Mobil. As the Mobil is more expensive, its up to others if its worth the extra cost over the XG. Contrary to what the OP posted, the M1 EP is not "a paper filter." The cost of both are a little higher for me, though I don't feel "stupid" when I buy it. Its expensive, yes, but I think you get what you for. -Spyder
$4 - $5 is alot considering the price of oil filters, that is like buying a car for 13,000 dollars when you could buy an equally good car made with better materials for 9,000 dollars, obviously you fall for the "if something is more expensive it must be better" deal.
As far as i know M1 is Purolator, so i will save money and go for the Purolator PureOne and save some cash, unless i don't feel like the PureOne i just grab the trusty old FL400s from walmart for under $4 I think the PureOnes cost on high side of $7 at my local Advance Auto Sometimes you do get what you pay for, but it only goes to a certain extent in some situations. There are deals on items at certain times that make it a more worthwhile choice than one that would previously be a coin toss had such a sale not been going on.
 
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May I also humbly say that the term"synthetic media" is being used as loosely to describe filter media as it is to desribe engine oils. There are some cellulose filters that are way better constructed than some "synthetic fiber" filters. I personally would rather have a German made Mann filter or a Wix heavy duty filter than some of the "synthetic"filters avalible at places like China-Mart.
 
Originally Posted By: trabuccomlfrd
Originally Posted By: Spyder7
It also holds a lot of "dirt." Double the dirt average of Fram's own OCOD. FRAM® Xtended Guard™ Oil Filter: Our Ultimate Engine Protection * Specially engineered filtering media arranged in two plies and reinforced with a metal screen to deliver up to 10,000 miles of engine protection.1 * Traps and holds more than double the dirt of leading economy oil filter brands' average.2 * 97% Dirt Trapping Efficiency2 * Silicone anti-drainback valve holds a reserve of oil in the filter to help protect the engine during start-ups I've been thinking about picking one up to attach to my vacuum. -Spyder
I dont understand your deal, the stupid marketing terms they use dont change how good the filter is. here is an example, if m1 put on there box that their filter is designed to "catch 99% of stuff" instead of "trap 99% contaminents" would it affect how good the filter preforms? i think not
My "deal" is that I found Fram's wording amusing. If you read further down into my next post I also stated that it looks like a good filter that can compete with the other heavy hitters in this price range (though some of the others cost more). I like Mobil 1 but don't buy it only because its double the price of the SOPUS stuff I'm using; I also like their oil filter, and there the price difference isn't so significant, so I buy and use it. Neither has prevented me from taking the odd cheap shot at Mobil for the iron levels in their UOAs; however, its made in jest as the amount is insignificant and much ado about nothing IMHO. I do buy and use Fram air filters. The price is right, quality is fine, and they seat perfectly. So I actually do buy and use Fram products, same as I do Mobil, and in both cases I'm satisfied that I'm getting what I pay for. However, in neither case does this preclude me from poking fun at either company now and then. Both are pretty big companies, and I don't think their sensibilities are so delicate that the odd jest is going to tarnish them - particularly when I go on to add that the product seems fine and I have no issues with it. Edit: I'll add that I find it amusing that you're so offended at what's clearly intended (just by reading my subsequent post) as a bit of a jest; while the OP gets a pass from everyone, yourself included, from a factually incorrect statement about the media used in the Mobil 1 EP, and subsequent comment "that he'd therefore feel stupid to buy one." I didn't write Fram's summary on the XG; I merely quoted it word for word. At least that is 100% accurate. Unlike the initial post this thread is based on which provides some pretty pictures, followed by a healthy dose of brand bashing with incorrect information tossed out as the basis for it. -Spyder
 
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Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
Originally Posted By: trabuccomlfrd
Originally Posted By: Spyder7
I don't use them. Not a knock against the XG (despite having some fun with the way Fram advertises it), but the cost difference for me between the XG and the M1 EP is so small that I just go with the Mobil. As the Mobil is more expensive, its up to others if its worth the extra cost over the XG. Contrary to what the OP posted, the M1 EP is not "a paper filter." The cost of both are a little higher for me, though I don't feel "stupid" when I buy it. Its expensive, yes, but I think you get what you for. -Spyder
$4 - $5 is alot considering the price of oil filters, that is like buying a car for 13,000 dollars when you could buy an equally good car made with better materials for 9,000 dollars, obviously you fall for the "if something is more expensive it must be better" deal.
As far as i know M1 is Purolator, so i will save money and go for the Purolator PureOne and save some cash, unless i don't feel like the PureOne i just grab the trusty old FL400s from walmart for under $4 I think the PureOnes cost on high side of $7 at my local Advance Auto Sometimes you do get what you pay for, but it only goes to a certain extent in some situations. There are deals on items at certain times that make it a more worthwhile choice than one that would previously be a coin toss had such a sale not been going on.
Then you don't seem to know much about it and should, imho, have taken the couple minutes a google search would have taken to provide the correct information rather than posting something that adds up to nothing, since this basis for the rest of your post is false. The Mobil filter is NOT made by Purolator. Its a "performance" design made by Champion Labs and sold under the Mobil 1 and K&N product brands. It is not offered to the consumer OTC by Champion Labs. If you want the filter you have two options, and neither involves Purolator: Mobil or K&N. -Spyder
 
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Originally Posted By: trabuccomlfrd
Originally Posted By: Spyder7
I don't use them. Not a knock against the XG (despite having some fun with the way Fram advertises it), but the cost difference for me between the XG and the M1 EP is so small that I just go with the Mobil. As the Mobil is more expensive, its up to others if its worth the extra cost over the XG. Contrary to what the OP posted, the M1 EP is not "a paper filter." The cost of both are a little higher for me, though I don't feel "stupid" when I buy it. Its expensive, yes, but I think you get what you for. -Spyder
$4 - $5 is alot considering the price of oil filters, that is like buying a car for 13,000 dollars when you could buy an equally good car made with better materials for 9,000 dollars, obviously you fall for the "if something is more expensive it must be better" deal.
Since when is a $4-$5 price difference the same as a $4,000 price difference? First mistake in reasoning (google "strawman"). Secondly, show the post that proves they are "equally good." That's not only not proven, but in your OP you based this on information that has been shown to be false: the M1 filter is not a "paper filter." Third, how do you "obviously" know what I base my buying decisions on? First off, I don't even know you, so if I were to discuss my purchase decisions with anyone, you wouldn't make the list. Lastly, how do you know that the difference in price where I am is $4-$5? If you look under my user name, I clearly don't live in the same place you do, therefore I don't shop at the same stores either. Do you just assume the difference is $4-$5 everywhere? Apparently you do, and you're wrong on that count too. Edit: one final point. Lets assume you're right about everything else (and we'll ignore for the moment the many ways I've demonstrated this not to be the case), and we'll go with the higher of your numbers and say the price difference for me is $5. Money is certainly a quantifiable subject when you're talking about it in absolute terms (for instance, my annual salary); what you're talking about, on the other hand, is not money, but value, and lacking perfect information (which, lacking information such as my annual salary, you don't even have the starting point to begin to make this assumption from), it cannot be quantified; only qualified. And then to properly qualify it, you need to know my disposable income, my own personal value choices and what is behind them, the actual difference in cost for me, and what that difference rationalizes out to in a monthly, weekly, or daily basis. You know none of this information. The only thing you know is that the extra cost isn't worth it to you. For the reasons given above, I'm not going to argue that with you. But you are very presumptuous to, lacking a single piece of the information needed to make a value judgment for me, state whether or not the price difference is worth it for me. -Spyder
 
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I humbly submit that everyone in the filter-making game knows who is charging what for their filters. If an $8 "synthetic" filter is equal in all ereas of build quality as a $13 filter you can bet somebody is going to adjust their price. There is no such thing as something for nothing yet people still want to think there is. I'm not saying the Fram "synthetic" is junk like their low-end filters but I do not believe for a second that it is on par with Donaldson,Amsoil,Wix(yes,some of Wix's part #s are full-synthetic media),Mobil1, or Royal Purple. Will the average consumer ever know the difference? Nope. The average buyer of "synthetic" filters will never know the difference between "synthetic" and cellulose either because they will not run the synthetic long enough to get the value out of it.
 
If the media filters better, you get the value out of it immediately as its doing what a cheaper filter can't do. A short OCI is sometimes a waste of money and it doesn't make a difference whether its a fancy synthetic or cheap paper media. I bet that the Fram XG/X2 is on par and maybe better than Amsoil, Donaldson, Wix, Mobil1, RoyalPurple.... Don't ever underestimate one of the highest volume filter brands. They can, when they want to, produce the best.
 
Originally Posted By: unDummy
If the media filters better, you get the value out of it immediately as its doing what a cheaper filter can't do. A short OCI is sometimes a waste of money and it doesn't make a difference whether its a fancy synthetic or cheap paper media. I bet that the Fram XG/X2 is on par and maybe better than Amsoil, Donaldson, Wix, Mobil1, RoyalPurple.... Don't ever underestimate one of the highest volume filter brands. They can, when they want to, produce the best.
In terms of filtering efficiency? we covered this in the other thread, it isn't. 97% vs 99.2% for the M1 filter (at 20 microns). Donaldson is 88% at 10 microns IIRC. The difference between FRAM and Donaldson is that Donaldson is OE on almost every large truck I've seen. Their filters and housings protect engines worth more than most people's cars. FRAM makes the filter you buy for a few bucks at Walmart and are the branded filter manufacturer for Honda (and I'm sure a few others). They are not only not playing in the same league, but they are playing two completely different sports. I'm not stating this to berate FRAM in any manner, but they are simply not catering to the same market, and subsequently they are not really comparable. Donaldson doesn't make a "cheap" filter. Neither does Fleetguard. Put another way: FRAM's orange can is competing for the filter spot on somebody's Civic, F-150, Silverado..etc with the Supertech, Purolator Classic and dealer filters. Donaldson is competing for the filter spots on your CAT, Cummins, Detroit, Mercedes..etc powered Kenworth, Peterbilt, Freightliner, Western Star, International...etc trucks with the likes of Hastings, Fleetguard, Lubrifiner and the like. The fact that Donaldson only makes TWO automotive application SYNTEQ filters should make it obvious enough that cars are NOT their target market.
 
This isn't a Fram orange can. Its the 'gold' can. Who did the filter efficiency testing? Comparisons are all but meaningless if only data came from the manufacturer.
 
Originally Posted By: unDummy
This isn't a Fram orange can. Its the 'gold' can. Who did the filter efficiency testing? Comparisons are all but meaningless if only data came from the manufacturer.
And what's meaningful for you then - the few pictures from the original post coupled with the wrong information on a competing filter and the conclusion the OP then cites as prove of, while managining to imply at the same time that those of us who buy Mobil must all be "stupid" for "throwing our money away on a paper filter." Overk1ll at least posted factual information that was otherwise missing, while in this thread I provided the data on it from the manufacturer's website verbatim (and in the other thread, for both the XG & M1). His information has been the most on-target, factual content offered in either thread. If you have something better, feel free to post it. -Spyder
 
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
Originally Posted By: trabuccomlfrd
Originally Posted By: Spyder7
I don't use them. Not a knock against the XG (despite having some fun with the way Fram advertises it), but the cost difference for me between the XG and the M1 EP is so small that I just go with the Mobil. As the Mobil is more expensive, its up to others if its worth the extra cost over the XG. Contrary to what the OP posted, the M1 EP is not "a paper filter." The cost of both are a little higher for me, though I don't feel "stupid" when I buy it. Its expensive, yes, but I think you get what you for. -Spyder
$4 - $5 is alot considering the price of oil filters, that is like buying a car for 13,000 dollars when you could buy an equally good car made with better materials for 9,000 dollars, obviously you fall for the "if something is more expensive it must be better" deal.
As far as i know M1 is Purolator, so i will save money and go for the Purolator PureOne and save some cash, unless i don't feel like the PureOne i just grab the trusty old FL400s from walmart for under $4 I think the PureOnes cost on high side of $7 at my local Advance Auto Sometimes you do get what you pay for, but it only goes to a certain extent in some situations. There are deals on items at certain times that make it a more worthwhile choice than one that would previously be a coin toss had such a sale not been going on.
i feel that you can do way better for the price of a pureone, i find pureones very un-impressive, i cut a fresh one open and the media doesnt even fill the whole can nor does it fill the endcaps. i can post pic of it if desired
 
I don't know about doing too much better than a PureOne in its price point. I'd say buying bulk from Fleetfilter would get you WIX for about a 40% discount to retail PureOne. I would speculate that the holding capacity is at par with it. But ..that said, I don't necessarily find them "impressive". They have a high level of retail distribution that's very hard to compete with for the performance level.
 
This filter fits the pricing structure of Walmart perfectly. They needed to carry a 10,000 mile filter to match the Castrol Edge and Mobil 1 EP offerings. The same crowd that buys their 5 quart jugs at Walmart is looking for a high mileage filter priced 30% less than a Mobil 1 at any of the parts stores. The parts stores can run their 5 quart + free Bosch Distanceplus or M1 filter to compete, but they aren't always running that special and you don't get to pick and choose your oil. Don't underestimate the high volume capabilities of Walmart + Honeywell to bring a fine product to market at a throat-cutting price.
 
That's why I buy my oil at WM (along with my Fram air filters), but go elsewhere for oil filters. I've never seen a parts store here offer a deal on oil + filter, though if they did the total cost would still likely be over what I pay for my oil at WM. I go into WM armed with enough knowledge to know what's what on their oil display, and what its worth to me. I buy ahead of time, when I don't need it, and have all the time I need to hold out for the really good rollbacks on the stuff I buy. My filters are bought and changed independently. The M1 I'm using now is intended for a 10k cycle, shortened only because its doing a cleaning phase, and like to have some buffer. As the engine cleans up, the interval will increase. Because of the way I buy oil, I save enough that I'm paying about the same as if I went in on some random day I decided to do the OC, and bought the oil I wanted to (just as I do now) but at its regular price plus the cheapest OCOD on the shelf. In the case of the oil I'm running now, the difference between the price it was bough for versus its normal regular price, is greater than the price of the filter I'm using with it. Done this way, it evens out. The filter is fully utilized, and I'm using both my oil and filter of choice at a reasonable price. And I feel I get my money out of both. As I'm the one who earns it and decides how to spend it, I am the only person that needs to be satisfied by my spending choices. I could care less if anyone else 'gets it' or agrees with it, as they don't earn my money for me they have no voice in how I spend it. Pretty simple really. Wish more people got that. -Spyder
 
Originally Posted By: Spyder7
That's why I buy my oil at WM (along with my Fram air filters), but go elsewhere for oil filters. I've never seen a parts store here offer a deal on oil + filter, though if they did the total cost would still likely be over what I pay for my oil at WM.
By the way, what are you paying for your filters out that way? I think we're around $12 to $14 for M1 filters. I don't know what Napa Gold filters cost, since I get Wix for $5. The only Purolators around here are those sold by Motorcraft and Mopar.
 
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