Yes, the statement that Better Diesel FBC works in pre-emissions engines would include indirect injection diesel (IDI) engines as well. The same catalytic acceleration of the fuel combustion rate applies. The only caveat for such older engines is the mechanical condition of the cylinder and rings. As long as an engine is not burning excessive amounts of engine oil, then it is likely a good candidate for the fuel borne catalyst treatment. On the other hand, if the engine is burning oil then it is likely that the rings are not sealing and/or there is cylinder liner wear. Loss of "ring seal" from mechanical wear will prevent the additional pressure created by the FBC to translate into more force against the moving piston. Instead, the additional pressure will be lost to "blow by" in which the exhaust gases escape into the engine crank case during the power stroke. This condition can also be diagnosed by used engine oil analysis and would be indicated by high soot levels and/or fuel dilution.
FBC "Better Diesel" and such
- Thread starter dnewton3
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The independent testing of diesel engines performed to date mainly focus on larger commercial size engines as opposed to the consumer market of light diesel engines. The smallest single-engine test is of the 2016 Cummins ISX CM 2350 rated at 550 hp as featured in https://betterdiesel.com/engine-test-results-using-better-diesel-fbc
That being said, the catalytic effect works on any internal combustion engine including gasoline engines. There are many owners of Ford F250's and F350's out there, most of whom have good things to say about their ongoing use of the FBC in their trucks. What we are finding over time as the numbers of end-users increase is that if a customer is not getting the expected results it is most likely due to an underlying problem that they have yet to diagnose and repair. Some guidelines of what to expect are up to +2 MPG over highway driving, more power under load and on hills, and less frequent DPF regens. If you are not seeing any improvements after the fourth tank treated or so, we recommend that you take the truck in for diagnostics via the on-board computer and/or have the ECM reset. If needed, it is also good to have the OEM dealer update the ECM software, as needed. Do not over-treat by using more FBC.
That being said, the catalytic effect works on any internal combustion engine including gasoline engines. There are many owners of Ford F250's and F350's out there, most of whom have good things to say about their ongoing use of the FBC in their trucks. What we are finding over time as the numbers of end-users increase is that if a customer is not getting the expected results it is most likely due to an underlying problem that they have yet to diagnose and repair. Some guidelines of what to expect are up to +2 MPG over highway driving, more power under load and on hills, and less frequent DPF regens. If you are not seeing any improvements after the fourth tank treated or so, we recommend that you take the truck in for diagnostics via the on-board computer and/or have the ECM reset. If needed, it is also good to have the OEM dealer update the ECM software, as needed. Do not over-treat by using more FBC.
Originally Posted by BetterDieselFBC
The independent testing of diesel engines performed to date mainly focus on larger commercial size engines as opposed to the consumer market of light diesel engines. The smallest single-engine test is of the 2016 Cummins ISX CM 2350 rated at 550 hp as featured in https://betterdiesel.com/engine-test-results-using-better-diesel-fbc/
That being said, the catalytic effect works on any internal combustion engine including gasoline engines. There are many owners of Ford F250's and F350's out there, most of whom have good things to say about their ongoing use of the FBC in their trucks. What we are finding over time as the numbers of end-users increase is that if a customer is not getting the expected results it is most likely due to an underlying problem that they have yet to diagnose and repair. Some guidelines of what to expect are up to +2 MPG over highway driving, more power under load and on hills, and less frequent DPF regens. If you are not seeing any improvements after the fourth tank treated or so, we recommend that you take the truck in for diagnostics via the on-board computer and/or have the ECM reset. If needed, it is also good to have the OEM dealer update the ECM software, as needed. Do not over-treat by using more FBC.
I thought so. I used enerburn for quite awhile and kept good logs. I felt for the use cycle of the light duty market does not fit this product so well. My truck had no issues and I did not see dramatic results claimed by the manufacturer. Granted this is just my experience and others may get different results. My regen average did go up using this product but not by a significant amount. In fact I noticed regens seemed to be more affected by fuel and driving style.
For awhile the murphy near me had diesel that was crystal clear and when the switched back to the yellow stuff my regen average started to go down. Also of course I get longer regen averages when I drive long distance, often close to 500. Around town 250 seems to be average. Enerburn changed this by about 15 data points. My test was in no way scientific, but I did not get the amazing results others are claiming. To me fuel quality and driving style has more to do with this than any other factor.
I now don't worry about regens at all, I let the truck do its thing and everything seems fine.
The independent testing of diesel engines performed to date mainly focus on larger commercial size engines as opposed to the consumer market of light diesel engines. The smallest single-engine test is of the 2016 Cummins ISX CM 2350 rated at 550 hp as featured in https://betterdiesel.com/engine-test-results-using-better-diesel-fbc/
That being said, the catalytic effect works on any internal combustion engine including gasoline engines. There are many owners of Ford F250's and F350's out there, most of whom have good things to say about their ongoing use of the FBC in their trucks. What we are finding over time as the numbers of end-users increase is that if a customer is not getting the expected results it is most likely due to an underlying problem that they have yet to diagnose and repair. Some guidelines of what to expect are up to +2 MPG over highway driving, more power under load and on hills, and less frequent DPF regens. If you are not seeing any improvements after the fourth tank treated or so, we recommend that you take the truck in for diagnostics via the on-board computer and/or have the ECM reset. If needed, it is also good to have the OEM dealer update the ECM software, as needed. Do not over-treat by using more FBC.
I thought so. I used enerburn for quite awhile and kept good logs. I felt for the use cycle of the light duty market does not fit this product so well. My truck had no issues and I did not see dramatic results claimed by the manufacturer. Granted this is just my experience and others may get different results. My regen average did go up using this product but not by a significant amount. In fact I noticed regens seemed to be more affected by fuel and driving style.
For awhile the murphy near me had diesel that was crystal clear and when the switched back to the yellow stuff my regen average started to go down. Also of course I get longer regen averages when I drive long distance, often close to 500. Around town 250 seems to be average. Enerburn changed this by about 15 data points. My test was in no way scientific, but I did not get the amazing results others are claiming. To me fuel quality and driving style has more to do with this than any other factor.
I now don't worry about regens at all, I let the truck do its thing and everything seems fine.
BTW I have 1 full bottle of enerburn left. I will ship it to anyone who has not used this product if the agree to log and note any differences in mileage and regen frequency then post the results.
Again this is not scientific in the way it will be tested but it will be another user experience.
Just FYI this is the older product and not what they sell now.
Again this is not scientific in the way it will be tested but it will be another user experience.
Just FYI this is the older product and not what they sell now.
The fundamental effect of any catalyst is to lower the amount of energy that is needed to make a chemical reaction "go". Of course, in this case we are talking about a combustion reaction in which hydrocarbon molecules in diesel fuel are combined with oxygen from air. Simply combining the two together does not cause them to react (burn). Energy from an external source must first be applied, typically in the form of heat or pressure. Less externally applied energy is required to initiate a reaction in the presence of a catalyst.
The products of a complete combustion reaction are CO2 (carbon dioxide), H2O (water) and, of course, heat (released from the chemical bonds as they break and rearrange). We want more of all of these, especially heat, in the engine world. And, we want less of the products of incomplete combustion, e.g., CO (carbon monoxide) and incompletely burned hydrocarbon in the form of toxic vapors and soot. The use of the fuel borne catalyst helps us accomplish a more complete burn of diesel during the power stroke of the engine, thus reducing harmful emissions (less CO, soot, and fumes) while improving fuel efficiency and engine performance. The fuel borne catalyst causes the onset of ignition to happen faster, about 30% faster in degrees crank angle. The fuel borne catalyst also results in a more complete burn of all shapes and sizes of diesel fuel molecules which burn at different rates.
Simply put, the FBC generates more heat at the right time and in the right place in an internal combustion engine. That is, during the power stroke while the piston is still moving. This additional force (from heated gases as they expand) translates to more work output, meaning, more horsepower for the same amount of fuel burned. Extra horsepower, as we all know, can manifest either as higher road speeds or heavier loads for the same amount of fuel consumed or better fuel economy at the same road speed and load or any combination thereof under real world driving conditions.
The products of a complete combustion reaction are CO2 (carbon dioxide), H2O (water) and, of course, heat (released from the chemical bonds as they break and rearrange). We want more of all of these, especially heat, in the engine world. And, we want less of the products of incomplete combustion, e.g., CO (carbon monoxide) and incompletely burned hydrocarbon in the form of toxic vapors and soot. The use of the fuel borne catalyst helps us accomplish a more complete burn of diesel during the power stroke of the engine, thus reducing harmful emissions (less CO, soot, and fumes) while improving fuel efficiency and engine performance. The fuel borne catalyst causes the onset of ignition to happen faster, about 30% faster in degrees crank angle. The fuel borne catalyst also results in a more complete burn of all shapes and sizes of diesel fuel molecules which burn at different rates.
Simply put, the FBC generates more heat at the right time and in the right place in an internal combustion engine. That is, during the power stroke while the piston is still moving. This additional force (from heated gases as they expand) translates to more work output, meaning, more horsepower for the same amount of fuel burned. Extra horsepower, as we all know, can manifest either as higher road speeds or heavier loads for the same amount of fuel consumed or better fuel economy at the same road speed and load or any combination thereof under real world driving conditions.
Great to hear that someone raised their hand for the extra bottle of Enerburn offered.
Now, please bear with me as I have to mention that the two products EnerBurn and Better Diesel FBC are not carbon copies of each other. They share in common the same catalyst active ingredient but nothing else. The same can be said for other brands of FBC's - each manufacturer has their own formula.
As the manufacturer of Better Diesel FBC and Max Mileage FBC I can also disclose that we have had "Zero" complaints from the field since it was introduced 18 months and over 40.3 million gallons of diesel treated ago. I think it is safe to say that there is a much larger customer base for Better Diesel FBC than for EnerBurn. Most of my former EnerBurn customers have switched to Better Diesel FBC. We have long since discontinued offering EnerBurn for sale on our website or through our resellers.
Now, please bear with me as I have to mention that the two products EnerBurn and Better Diesel FBC are not carbon copies of each other. They share in common the same catalyst active ingredient but nothing else. The same can be said for other brands of FBC's - each manufacturer has their own formula.
As the manufacturer of Better Diesel FBC and Max Mileage FBC I can also disclose that we have had "Zero" complaints from the field since it was introduced 18 months and over 40.3 million gallons of diesel treated ago. I think it is safe to say that there is a much larger customer base for Better Diesel FBC than for EnerBurn. Most of my former EnerBurn customers have switched to Better Diesel FBC. We have long since discontinued offering EnerBurn for sale on our website or through our resellers.
"With regards to this product I have not seen a MSDS so we can't be certain this just isn't some basic additive such as 2EHN."
The main active ingredients in Better Diesel FBC are the fuel borne catalyst "chemistry" and a very good fuel injector cleaner. It does not contain a cetane improver such as 2EHN. I frequently get asked if it is okay to use Better Diesel FBC along with 1) a cold flow improver or "anti-gel" additive or 2) a cetane improver additive, or 3) a lubricity additive. The answer is, Yes, they can be used together safely. Just do not mix chemicals with each other prior to adding to fuel.
The main active ingredients in Better Diesel FBC are the fuel borne catalyst "chemistry" and a very good fuel injector cleaner. It does not contain a cetane improver such as 2EHN. I frequently get asked if it is okay to use Better Diesel FBC along with 1) a cold flow improver or "anti-gel" additive or 2) a cetane improver additive, or 3) a lubricity additive. The answer is, Yes, they can be used together safely. Just do not mix chemicals with each other prior to adding to fuel.
JHZR2
Staff member
Is this available in any stores? $19.50 in shipping on two 16oz bottles is a pretty big cost. I'm sure it costs a ton for UPS or others to ship this, so finding locally might be helpful.
Yes, absolutely. Max Mileage is available at more than 50 dealer locations throughout the US and Canada. However, most of these dealers do not stock the 16-ounce squeeze applicator bottles. Rather, they carry the 1-gallon jugs for their heavy duty transport truck customers. Here is the map of locations: https://pittsburghpower.com/pages/max-mileage
Just scroll down to the bottom of the page to view the map of dealer locations.
But, back to the 2-pack, 16-ounce bottle package that ships from Better Diesel FBC, Inc for $19.50. Yes, that does indeed include our costs for the special packaging as required by FedEx for shipping Hazmat product. https://betterdiesel.com/shop/
Just scroll down to the bottom of the page to view the map of dealer locations.
But, back to the 2-pack, 16-ounce bottle package that ships from Better Diesel FBC, Inc for $19.50. Yes, that does indeed include our costs for the special packaging as required by FedEx for shipping Hazmat product. https://betterdiesel.com/shop/
JHZR2
Staff member
Thanks, that helps. I get it that the costs for shipping chemicals and hazmat are big $$$; not much you can do about it. I travel close to Bowie, MD quite a bit, so perhaps I can get some from there. Or next time I'm on I-95 in NC, I'll hit up Kenly. Thanks!
Originally Posted by JHZR2
Thanks, that helps. I get it that the costs for shipping chemicals and hazmat are big $$$; not much you can do about it. I travel close to Bowie, MD quite a bit, so perhaps I can get some from there. Or next time I'm on I-95 in NC, I'll hit up Kenly. Thanks!
I think there's a station near Kenly that has B99 as well.
I hate how hard it is to get bio here in NC
Thanks, that helps. I get it that the costs for shipping chemicals and hazmat are big $$$; not much you can do about it. I travel close to Bowie, MD quite a bit, so perhaps I can get some from there. Or next time I'm on I-95 in NC, I'll hit up Kenly. Thanks!
I think there's a station near Kenly that has B99 as well.
I hate how hard it is to get bio here in NC
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