Euro Synthetic 5W30 Oils Used In American Branded GDI Engines ?

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ChrisD46

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An increasing number of forum members are touting the virtues of using Synthetic Euro Oils (i.e. M1 ESP 5W30 , Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W30 and Castrol EDGE LL 5W30) as being superior for American bought / branded GDI engines . So , do these Euro synthetic 5W30 oils offer any significant advantage to current SP rated D1 / Gen 2 level of American synthetic oils currently used in modern GDI engine applications ? Do the Euro low ash synthetic oils perform well with American gasolines ? ... The only thing that jumps out in the Euro synthetic oil specs for 5W30 is that they are thicker 30W oils (pushing 12 cSt) and with an HTHS at 3.5 versus the lower 3.0 ~ 3.2 of American 5W30 SP / D1 Gen 2 oils . Lastly , is there some magic Euro formulation proven to be superior for preventing GDI engine intake valve deposits versus the American branded synthetic 5W30 SP / D1 Gen 2 synthetic 5W30 oils ? Currently I use synthetic Valvoline Advanced 5W30 SP / D1 Gen 2 rated oil for a OCI of < 5,000 miles OCI in a Hyundai 2.4L (non - turbo) engine and I want to know if I can do better by using the Euro synthetic 5W30 oils with all the Euro car engine specs met in my Korean Hyundai Sonata ? Thanks in advance for the FACTS .
 
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I think ACEA standards and European specs (MB, BMW, VW, Porsche, etc.) are in general driven from their driving habits and conditions. e.g. long oci, redlining engines, high rpm/speed for long duration due to high and/or no speed limits, smaller engines, more abusive driving conditions , etc.

I guess if ACEA and European manufacturers had to come up with standards and spec for engine oil in US, it would be more similar to API. I don't think the engines are that much different.You can drive the same BMW here and it never sees 85mph. I know couple of co-workers like that. BMWs over there are doing 100mph everyday.

You know necessity is the mother of invention ... anyway, pure speculation on my part.
 
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Many of the euro automakers don't recognize the existence of LPSI, except for Mercedes. That's why they came up with 229.52 standard.
 
never seen any mention of LSPI on any VAG volkswagen auto group vehicle, so if its not broke WHY try to fix it!
 
UG_Passat said:
Many of the euro automakers don't recognize the existence of LPSI, except for Mercedes. That's why they came up with 229.52 standard.
Click to expand...
Thanks, I knew some Euro OEMs now includes LSPI, but I couldn’t remember which.

Is MB 229.52 the same as MB 229.5 or MB 229.51 with just a LSPI test added, or is their more to it than that?

I think @edyvw mentioned something about an update to a VW spec too.


Edit: Found it “MB229.52 and VW 504.00/507.00 (2020 update). Both have LSPI test included in approval”
 
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Just found this

Understanding the Daimler MB 229.52 Specification

OEMs often go way beyond the ACEA baseline when publishing their own service-fill engine lubricant specifications. Here we discuss the Daimler MB 229.52 lower SAPS service-fill specification for high performance engines.
360.lubrizol.com 360.lubrizol.com


“ The MB 229.52 specification was primarily tailored for Mercedes-Benz vehicles equipped with BlueTEC® diesel technology. These are equipped with SCR, enabling the reduction of nitrogen oxides (NOx) emissions through the use of AdBlue®. It particularly applies to the new six-cylinder OM642 diesel engine with the Euro 6 emissions standard.

Marketed by Daimler as “Low SPAsh multigrade service engine oils,” approved MB 229.52 lubricants must deliver at least 0.7% fuel economy improvement compared to the MB 229.51 and MB 229.31 specifications. To achieve this, lubricants must have improved cold flow properties to reduce friction within the engine, allowing oil to flow effectively at start-up. This lowers the vehicle’s fuel consumption by increasing efficiency.

Building upon the industry baseline of ACEA C3, lubricants approved to the MB 229.52 long life oil specification are backwards compatible with the MB 229.51 and MB 229.31 specifications, being suitable for a range of gasoline and diesel engines with or without a GPF/DPF.

The MB 229.52 specification has evolved since its launch, with the Daimler LSPI test being added to the engine test requirements. It is also formulated to go above and beyond the ACEA baseline through:

Additional bench tests for oxidation, wear and corrosion
Additional engine tests for wear, fuel economy and Low Speed Pre-Ignition (LSPI)
More stringent test limits for foaming, pumpability, oxidation, sludge, diesel wear and biofuel”
 
Given that VW 504/507 and MB 229.52 are both low SAPS oils, does any Euro OEM include a LSPI test in a high SAPS A3/B4 oil ?
 
*Perhaps more concisely - "How does using a 5W30 Euro synthetic oil (like brands listed above) help my Hyundai 2.4L GDI engine to run better / cleaner than using 5W30 Synthetic D1 / Gen 2 USA brands in my same vehicle" ? ... *What's the magic elixir with synthetic Euro oils used in a GDI engine again versus a synthetic D1 / Gen 2 oil used in a GDI engine ?
 
Higher HTHS vs fuel dilution

I also wouldn't be proud of the D1/G1, D1/G2, and soon to be released D1/G3 oils when your engine is already consuming a quart ~4000 miles with all that supposedly extra maintenance that you're doing. Skip the D1 oils and use the D2 oils.

Someone else posted this comparing an API/ILSAC SP oil to a Euro VW 508 oil.
508SP.jpg
 
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Greasymechtech said:
Higher HTHS vs fuel dilution

I also wouldn't be proud of the D1/G1, D1/G2, and soon to be released D1/G3 oils when your engine is already consuming a quart ~4000 miles with all that supposedly extra maintenance that you're doing. Skip the D1 oils and use the D2 oils.

Someone else posted this comparing an API/ILSAC SP oil to a Euro VW 508 oil.
View attachment 43031
Click to expand...


I would venture to say that most oil consumption is not because of the oil but because of the owner.
 
An engine that became known as short-lived, filmed on a sump test rig – that's the kind of material the mythical A40 ideas must be inspired by.
 
Thank you, edyvw. It's good to repeat the sump test part ;-) Some might get it totally wrong from reading it only once.
 
I’m a complete neophyte when it comes to motor oil characterization, but I wouldn’t say the same when it comes to digesting information. Some of the tests I’ve heard they run to pass the VW 504/507 approval are insane. It’s almost like they’re trying to make the oil fail on purpose.

Only those oils that don’t fail may qualify for the approval. My two cents.
 
504/507 oils are pretty dang good. When they can be had for about 5 bucks a quart on sale it is a no brainer for me to use them broadly in different vehicles I service. Whether you should use them in your Kia is totally up to you. If you are satisfied with the performance of the spec oil than you answered your own question.
 
sloinker said:
504/507 oils are pretty dang good. When they can be had for about 5 bucks a quart on sale it is a no brainer for me to use them broadly in different vehicles I service. Whether you should use them in your Kia is totally up to you. If you are satisfied with the performance of the spec oil than you answered your own question.
Click to expand...
Agree. Not necessarily Kia’s , but Toyota’s last a lifetime on lowly API Oils. But the question was about the “superiority” of Euros, i.e., approvals.
And I don’t see why a KIA would not benefit from them vs e.g., “Fram” Oil.
 
Greasymechtech said:
Higher HTHS vs fuel dilution

I also wouldn't be proud of the D1/G1, D1/G2, and soon to be released D1/G3 oils when your engine is already consuming a quart ~4000 miles with all that supposedly extra maintenance that you're doing. Skip the D1 oils and use the D2 oils.

Someone else posted this comparing an API/ILSAC SP oil to a Euro VW 508 oil.
View attachment 43031
Click to expand...


That's not how the tool should be used.... ;)

Relative Performance Comparison Tool for Passenger Car Specifications - Engine Oil Additives - The Lubrizol Corporation

online.lubrizol.com online.lubrizol.com

1612912969756.png
 
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