Esters in Motorcycles

[Velo_Fello]

I understand that one of the advantages of Group V ester based synthetics is that they are polar. They stick to the inside of the engine.

I once removed the valve cover on my Kawasaki EX500 to check valve clearances. It was running on Motul based on Group V. Sure enough, oil was sticking to the underneath of the valve cover. I ran my finger on the underneath of the cover and oil ran down my hand, quite literally. Oil was sticking to everything, not just the valve cover.

I repeated this with Castrol Syntec after the changeover to Group III (not knowing about the substitution). This time, the cover was almost bone dry, and the rest of the visible top end also.

These experiences lead me to think that one advantage of using Group V is that there would be no dry start-ups. Some oil would remain sticking to the bearings, rings, cams, etc.

Questions:
1. What is the general consensus on this? (I’ve run this question on another thread, without reaching any real consensus.)

2. What oils are ester-based? I understand they include Motul (some), Redline (all), and Maxima (all). Is this true, and are there others?

 

[Zedhed]

Motul (most)

 

[StromRider]

Originally Posted By: Velo_Fello

Questions:

2. What oils are ester-based? I understand they include Motul (some), Redline (all), and Maxima (all). Is this true, and are there others?


Silkolene has ester based oils. I am trying out their 10w-40 ester based synthetic now and will do a UOA in a few months.

 

[whitesands]

Sounds like an interesting observation you made....It would be interesting what would happen if you dipped a flat piece of aluminum in an ester and another in a conventional of the same weight then let them set them vertically so that it runs down...leave it there for a set amount of time and see which one retains the most....I'm sure there is a better method of finding out but it may have some validity to it...

 

[Velo_Fello]

Brilliant idea!

 

[Klotz1]

For a Air Cooled engine, I would run nothing but a group V oil, especially if you are riding in a warm climate. My choice of oil is Klotz, group v also. My snowmobile buddies love to run it in their modern day power valve 2 stroke engines.

 

[Zedhed]

Grp V? Motul or Maxima maybe RL Nothing else will do.

BTW, didn't know Klotz was Grp V

 

[BigCahuna]

Originally Posted By: Klotz1
For a Air Cooled engine, I would run nothing but a group V oil, especially if you are riding in a warm climate. My choice of oil is Klotz, group v also. My snowmobile buddies love to run it in their modern day power valve 2 stroke engines.
You got some proof that klotz will perform any better then Amsoil, redline, mobil 1 vtwin,or even Harley syn III ?.Any VOI's or UOA's? And whats it's history? I've never heard of it until you stated recommending it.,,

 

[rraiderr]

Maxima Ultra is 100% ester based, I emailed them and asked.

 

[Klotz1]

I never said Klotz is better then others, its just my favorite personal choice. I have ran all the other oils that you have mentioned and I seen LITTLE to NO improvements. When I put Klotz in my Harley/Truck I noticed the engine turns over quicker, it runs smoother with less engine noise & HEAT. No need for a VOI or a UOA!!.. Klotz has been been mastering the sience of synthetic oil for 50 years. Visit them at Klotzlube.com, I also run their Trans & chain case fluids. The only draw back with this oil is the price, around 10-12 bucks per quart, I guess you pay for what you get?.. Everyone that has tried it, Loves it and never goes back. This is just my opinon. I don't sell the stuff or anything like that.

 

[BigCahuna]

If you have seen little or no improvement using klotz oil over the other leading brands, what is your reason for choosing it over say Mobil 1 v-twin that can be had for $5 a qt less? A new battery will make your motor turn over faster. And I would think on this site a VOA and a UOA, means more the being in the oil business for any length of time.I checked their site and it looks like their oil is more designed for the racing crowd.Short runs and oci's.I'd like to hear some remarks from other who use it for road use, with standard oci's, before I would consider spending $12.99 a qt for oil.,

 

[azsynthetic]

You can check with Klotz but I believe their racing oil is 60% ester. Klotz claims that their racing oil is 60% biodegradable.

 

[Klotz1]

A little comment on ester from mobile 1? Esters are stable molecules, provide good solvency, and provide very good low temperature and high temperature performance in engine oils.

 

[wileyE]

'polar" is at a molecular level, your not going to see or feel any difference in it sticking or flowing down a flat panel.

Group #'s were never meant to imply good better best in finished oil product performance.

just my 02.