Engine Overhaul

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769
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Palouse WA
I am rebuilding a 88 Corolla engine to drop into my 86 Corolla (same engine type [Razz] ) But I have no clue as to what oil weight to use for break in or type for that matter [I dont know] After break in I am thinking of going AMSOIL or Mobil 1 The temps here are mild in the winter Down to 2 or 3 degrees and summers are a scorcher extended periods of 80's 90's and even a few 100 degree days. Oh what weight to use for this basically new engine. [I dont know] The engine will be a complete rebuild all new except for the Block, Crank and rods oh and the head too [Big Grin] Ken
 
Messages
713
Location
Pennsylvania
quote:
Originally posted by Ken42: I am rebuilding a 88 Corolla engine to drop into my 86 Corolla (same engine type [Razz] ) But I have no clue as to what oil weight to use for break in or type for that matter [I dont know] After break in I am thinking of going AMSOIL or Mobil 1 The temps here are mild in the winter Down to 2 or 3 degrees and summers are a scorcher extended periods of 80's 90's and even a few 100 degree days. Oh what weight to use for this basically new engine. [I dont know] The engine will be a complete rebuild all new except for the Block, Crank and rods oh and the head too [Big Grin] Ken
the older toys required heavy oil - 20-50 in most climes. so grab some castrol or wally world inthe correct weight and dump it in, change it 1000 miles in, then goto regular changes
 
Messages
713
Location
Pennsylvania
quote:
Originally posted by Ken42: QuadDriver does this hold true even for a rebuilt engine? Cause of the wider tolerences?
well if you used the same specs and clearances...then yes. there is a ton of expansion and uneven expansion in those motors, my experience has shown that while pressure holds up well (bearing clearances), on 5/10-30 oils they drink and drink long - we are talking a quart a gas tank, yet when you run the 20-50 consumption returns to normal. Im going from hazy memory, but when I last looked at an older toy manual, I think one of the weights was 25-50 which I dont think is even available in the US. your manual should give you the correct weight for this time of year.. Dont beleive the horror stories about syn oils for example not letting an engine break in. Any metal that is gonna get knocked off in mass quantities is gonna get knocked off in the next few miles - that is why that 1000 mile interval is important and since its so short - use cheap stuff. and after that keep an eye on consumption....oil usage will depend on how fast the rings wear in. helpful rebuilding tip: when inserting the piston/rod assembly into the block, cut a 2L bottle or milk jug in two and fill with motor oil, give eash piston a good dunk before you put it in. this will keep the rings from sticking and will lube the piston walls well those first few critical rpms.
 

Ken42

Thread starter
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769
Location
Palouse WA
The manual calls for on the 86 15-40, 20-40, 20-50 from 10 to 100+ F or 10-30, 10-40, 10-50 for 0 to 100+ F or for winter 5-30 from 50+ F down. Yes I am keeping the same bearing and piston deminsions. Ken
 
My experience is that because of the cost of parts, especially from the factory, you will save only a few hundred dollars rebuilding a Toyota engine yourself over buying a rebuilt unit. Also, many do-it-yourselfers scrimp in areas such as engine honing; these days, loading the top of the engine to simulate the weight and force of the head and studs while boring and honing is highly recommended, but most home rebuilders aren't equipped to do this. I say let the pros do it. And you'll have a warranty and recourse if the rebuilt unit has problems. I've heard of all kinds of oils for break-in. Red Line still recommends using a dino oil for the first 2,000 miles after a rebuild before switching to synthetic, because of the wall glazing issue. Those engines that use synthetic for a factory fill, including Porsche and Chevrolet Corvette, have special (expensive) proprietary honing procedures done at the factory to prevent glazing. My thought is to use a good dino 5W30 to start, change the oil and filter at 1,000 miles, refill with fresh dino, run till time for the first oil change at 3,000 miles, and then change oil to your favorite synthetic along with the filter. And drive gently until that 3,000-mile mark.
 
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901
Location
Northern Illinois
Seems like I have heard that used engines from Japan are available real cheap because of regulations over there. You might check that out. On second thought I guess you already have the engine but others might read this. Good Luck, RW
 
Messages
713
Location
Pennsylvania
quote:
Originally posted by Ken42: The manual calls for on the 86 15-40, 20-40, 20-50 from 10 to 100+ F or 10-30, 10-40, 10-50 for 0 to 100+ F or for winter 5-30 from 50+ F down. Yes I am keeping the same bearing and piston deminsions. Ken
well for summer time its pretty apparent toy wants you to use some heavier stuff...Id say dont disappoint them! Ive never seen 20-40 (mebbe thats whay my hazy memory recalls - not the 25-50) at any rate, people say they get the best service on the old I4 toys with 20-50 so go for it.
 
Messages
713
Location
Pennsylvania
quote:
Originally posted by ekrampitzjr: Those engines that use synthetic for a factory fill, including Porsche and Chevrolet Corvette, have special (expensive) proprietary honing procedures done at the factory to prevent glazing.
wanna know what they are? a one way hone now, such that the hone marks are like a 'screw' thread instead of crosshatch to turn the rings constantly in one direction. also, chevy is now recommending NO HONE at all! just a rougher cut cylinder bore .001wrms I think
 

Ken42

Thread starter
Messages
769
Location
Palouse WA
[Off Topic!] To calm fears YES the block, crank, rods and head went to a professional machine shop to be bored, honed, turned and polished and reconditioned too. I will be doing none of the machine work just putting it together total cost to me about $600
 

Ken42

Thread starter
Messages
769
Location
Palouse WA
quote:
Originally posted by Ken42: [Off Topic!] To calm fears YES the block, crank, rods and head went to a professional machine shop to be bored, honed, turned and polished and reconditioned too. I will be doing none of the machine work just putting it together total cost to me about $600
Why rebuild? Cause I can't find a good condition 4alc engine the ones that are good are gone and nothing but junk is left. As far as import used japanese engines I can't get the 4ac. I was lucky to get the engine I did with 104k on it. But when I inspected it I found that #4 rod journal had scorched [Bang Head]
 
Messages
713
Location
Pennsylvania
quote:
Originally posted by Ken42:
quote:
Originally posted by Ken42: [Off Topic!] To calm fears YES the block, crank, rods and head went to a professional machine shop to be bored, honed, turned and polished and reconditioned too. I will be doing none of the machine work just putting it together total cost to me about $600
Why rebuild? Cause I can't find a good condition 4alc engine the ones that are good are gone and nothing but junk is left. As far as import used japanese engines I can't get the 4ac. I was lucky to get the engine I did with 104k on it. But when I inspected it I found that #4 rod journal had scorched [Bang Head]

thats a good segue for my next handy dandy rebuilding tip.... when priming the oil pump in the motor, have a pal turn the crank by hand, slowly, at 90 degree intervals for about 4-5 revolutions. what that does is purge the crank and all the passages of air. otherwise on startup, the bearings furthest from the pump suffer....
 

Ken42

Thread starter
Messages
769
Location
Palouse WA
Heck my Engine drinks about 1/2 qt every tank at 214K with stuck gummed rings, extremely low compressiion 110 to 60 and the rear main seal leaking. And I would assume tared up valves. So your saying it will drink more after I put in the rebuilt motor? Ken
quote:
Originally posted by QuadDriver:
quote:
Originally posted by Ken42: QuadDriver does this hold true even for a rebuilt engine? Cause of the wider tolerences?
well if you used the same specs and clearances...then yes. there is a ton of expansion and uneven expansion in those motors, my experience has shown that while pressure holds up well (bearing clearances), on 5/10-30 oils they drink and drink long - we are talking a quart a gas tank, yet when you run the 20-50 consumption returns to normal.

 
Messages
9,448
Location
USA
First things first call call NorthernAutoParts and get price for rebuild kit. They have the best prices on name brand kits. I use them for all my stock OEM rebuilds. Their kits are TRW,SEALED Power, Fed.Mogal,Felpropreimium gaskets, moly and SS rings, NOK seals....... THeir prices are excellent. I highly recomend Redline assembly lube because it does not plug up filter like moly grease does. Use a cheap HD30 for the first 20 minutes of run in. After you prime the system and set the timeing you want to fire her up and run her for 20 minutes at 2000 RPM's.Shut the engine down drain and refill with a decent oil like Delvac 1300 15W40 or Delo 15W40. Change filter and drive / break in as you choose for the next 600-1000 miles drain and refill with oil of your choice and then do standard drain interval. If you use conventional oil follow the manual and if you chose synthetics you can go one grade either way of the manualy based on temp!
 

MolaKule

Staff member
Messages
21,591
Location
Iowegia - USA
quote:
Dont beleive the horror stories about syn oils for example not letting an engine break in.
The engine will "run-in" on synthetics, it just takes longer. Secondly, it is not economical to run-in an engine with costly synthetics when you may have oil consumption during run-in. Any OTC dino will do the job for run-in and be less costly in the short term..
 
Messages
9,365
Location
USA
quote:
Originally posted by Ken42: I am rebuilding a 88 Corolla engine to drop into my 86 Corolla (same engine type [Razz] ) But I have no clue as to what oil weight to use for break in or type for that matter [I dont know] After break in I am thinking of going AMSOIL or Mobil 1 The temps here are mild in the winter Down to 2 or 3 degrees and summers are a scorcher extended periods of 80's 90's and even a few 100 degree days. Oh what weight to use for this basically new engine. [I dont know] The engine will be a complete rebuild all new except for the Block, Crank and rods oh and the head too [Big Grin] Ken
hey ken I have a 87 corolla with 183k miles that has been sitting due to a blown engine. I would like to get it rebuilt. 4ac engine though. [Frown] are you rebuilding the engine yourself or having a shop do it? I have looked into getting a remanufactured engine from jasper engines but the quote is for $1750. kinda steep for me. looking for a low cost way to do it.
 

Ken42

Thread starter
Messages
769
Location
Palouse WA
Thanks all....... Noticed there sure is alot of opinions on how to run-in an rebuilt engine. As far as the first oil goes I will use a good quality Dino oil. But nothing pricy. JohnBrowning sorry I don't do rebuild kits. Gaskets are the only Kit I will get and it is NOK / Ishino. All parts are Sealed Power, Fed.Mogal And I have allready sourced and acquired all parts... Except oil which brand should I go with for a rebuild after break in? Now RedLine rebuilders grease will look into that anybody got a source? Ken
 

Ken42

Thread starter
Messages
769
Location
Palouse WA
Not to bring up a dead horse but got my block back yesterday and painted it purple [Smile] Royal Purple [Big Grin] Was at the library today and saw in the car books that the engine specs on my 86 Corolla and a 2002 Corolla are the SAME! So to the dead horse part other then fuel economy why does Toyota say 5W-30 for the 2002 and 15W-40 to 20W-50 or 10-W30 to 10W-50 and for winter 5W-30 for the 86? Can't be cause of tollerences they are the same. Ken [ July 24, 2003, 11:34 PM: Message edited by: Ken42 ]
 
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3,593
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Outside smalltown, IL
I ran 5W-20 then 5W-30 Mobil-1 in my 1980 Corolla 3-TC engine from the first oil change at 2000 miles. It had 160K miles on it when I got rid of it and still didn't use any oil. The few times I had the valve cover off it was pretty clean inside. I think I'd use a good quality dino for initial break-in and use 5W-30 or 10W-30 M1 after that... [ July 25, 2003, 12:28 AM: Message edited by: jsharp ]
 
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