Effects of Racing in Normal Car

[OriginHacker21]

How bad is it to race/run the engine hard on a normal/everyday engine? I've recently gotten into NASCAR and motorcycle racing (I like the endurance 100+lap races). Those engines are running at WOT and insane RPMS - sure they have engines designed for it but - what about our engines? How harmful is it to run high RPMS and WOT on our cars? (Spirited Driving)

I'm sure WOT from 0mph has to be the hardest on the transmission/engine but what about letting the RPMs go a little high? (5krpms) Does that hurt/damage the engine a lot?

So anyway, just wondering how much its going to hurt my little 2.2L engine with synthetic oil to do a little spirited driving (under the speed limit of course)

 

[OriginHacker21]

Also - does it hurt an engine to never go above 3,000rpms or never do any spirited driving? (carbon buildup, etc...)?

 

[dailydriver]

What is the redline on your Ecotec? As long as you are using a very good oil, and keep it 200-300 revs BELOW the redline, for not very long periods, you should be OK.
It probably does help, at least once and a while to go WOT, especially if you drive "like a granny" most of the time.

 

[jonny-b]

I'm not sure, but it probably depends on combustion chamber design, how accurate the amount of fuel/air is injected at the different RPMs, the quality of lubrication and many other factors. I do believe that periods with higher rpms will make the oil flow faster and wash away particles stuck on the metal.

 

[cousincletus]

From what I've heard the Eco can take a beating. 3K shouldn't hurt anything. I take mine to that every day on the on-ramp of I-95 here in Richmond (better to run the engine a little than get run over).

 

[rpn453]

My Mazda3 probably sees 5k on every drive, and 7k at least a couple of times a month. I read (in either Motor Trend or C&D) that Ford tests engine designs with 300 hours of running WOT, cycling between the torque peak and the horsepower peak, to weed out any major design flaws. I assume other manufacturers have similar testing. So that would be 300 hours at WOT going from 4000 rpm to 6500 rpm on my car. Also, think of all the abuse the engines take from weekend racers and magazine test drivers. I'm not worried about anything but the rev limiter when I need/want to get going in a hurry!

 

[Lonnie]

Racing a stock car causes more wear and tear and raises you insurance when you start hitting things. Tickets get more expensive and ones for a high enough speed you get room and board. If you race on a track it is much better. It's cheaper to hit pylons than parked cars and your friends can help you lean to drive better and do some of the maintenance things you will want to lean. And it's fun, too. You will also have an excuse to run synthetic oil and buy a digital tire pressure gauge and maybe a scan gauge too.

 

[OriginHacker21]

Daily Driver - redline is 6,400 but the paint could be wrong so I think it is officially 6,500.

Back in 2002 I was pulled over by a Highway Patrol officer when I passed him going 90mph racing someone in a 45mph zone. By the time he got in his car and went after me - I was going 40mph (what read on the ticket). He decided to get me for my tinted windows. After that, nearly crapping my pants, I've decided to never race up to those speeds again. This was before I had my own car and a brain.

The "ticket" was a citation that didn't go on the record - cost $15 and the tint on my dad's car. Just for your information.

Now with my own car that I baby - I wouldn't mind taking a twisty road in a lower gear (high rpms) and feeling the power once in awhile staying well within speed limit. It is nice to hear/feel your car sing

. Just curious how harmful this is.

This evening (after making the post) - there is an entrance onto a freeway that is uphill - I love to gas it up the hill to 70mph. I don't quite floor it but - almost. The little car is fast going up that hill compared to the heavy and loud SUVs.

 

[OriginHacker21]

So from what I gather from the posts - it doesn't seem like being a little harder on your car is going to hurt much - as long as you aren't bouncing off the rev-limiter. In fact, it could help clear things up (higher oil psi)...

After driving for 55,000 miles in 1 year at 70mph (2,600 rpm) - you kinda want to hear your car do something else on the weekend.

 

[ShiningArcanine]

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Now with my own car that I baby - I wouldn't mind taking a twisty road in a lower gear (high rpms) and feeling the power once in awhile staying well within speed limit. It is nice to hear/feel your car sing

. Just curious how harmful this is.

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It is very harmful if you care about your wallets, gasoline prices or our dependency on foreign oil.

 

[BillionPa]

my BMW hits 5K rpm range multiple times on my 12 min drive back home from work, and on the way to work as well. engine is in superb condition for 152000 miles, and the transmission still works, but the wheel bearings were toast, and the power steering box leaks quite a bit.

 

[rpn453]

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It is very harmful if you care about your wallets, gasoline prices or our dependency on foreign oil.

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Him driving in a lower gear occasionally is right up there on the global concerns list, just below the issue of how my personal exhalation of CO2 is contributing to global warming.

 

[widman]

Depends a lot on the engine. I've got a little ford pickup with a 1.4. It hates to be under 3000 rpm (shudders), but keep it between 3000 and 5000 and it is a peppy little truck.

 

[windnsea00]

I know for BMW, their bottom ends are built very roubust to endure extended periods of high end revving (Autobahn). It's quite common to see a well running BMW engine with 200k+ miles of daily driving and heavy track usage.

Personally, I've never worried about revving our cars high (once the oil is warm)...they all come alive at 4k+ rpms anyway. I believe German engines in general are built for harder driving compared to a basic A to B engine.

 

[Whimsey]

I have a '96 Ford Contour with the 2.0L Zetec and 5 speed. While I don't drive at redline consistantly I usually do reach it just about everytime I'm merging onto the highway. Also when on hilly roads in lower gears I like to run it in higher rpm's. The car seems to run sooo much better at 3,000 rpm and above. With Mobil 1 5W-30 I'd use some oil, +/- 1/2 quart in a 5,000 mile OCI. Using Schaeffer's Supreme Blend 5W-30 it doesn't use ANY oil in the 5,000 mile OCI's. I'm old enough to still think of occasional redline visits as an "Italian tune-up"

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As long as your engine is in good shape occasional visits to the redline shouldn't hurt it.

Whimsey

 

[Tree Hugger]

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This evening (after making the post) - there is an entrance onto a freeway that is uphill - I love to gas it up the hill to 70mph. I don't quite floor it but - almost. The little car is fast going up that hill compared to the heavy and loud SUVs.

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I believe the true american phrase for this is "Point 'er up the on-ramp, and let 'er eat!"

 

[1999nick]

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It is very harmful if you care about your wallets, gasoline prices or our dependency on foreign oil.

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Him driving in a lower gear occasionally is right up there on the global concerns list, just below the issue of how my personal exhalation of CO2 is contributing to global warming.

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That is the real polution worry: I understand that each and every person on the face of the earth exhales 2.5 pounds of C02 every day. What are the scientists doing about that?

 

[carock]

In the old days American engines were not able to sustain high RPM's without risking premature engine wear. The V-8's were capable of short acceleration bursts, but unless you had a special Corvette, Mopar, or Boss 302 type engine, the cars could not withstand 4000 rpm use for long. At that time, you could hammer any Italian engine, and they would last longer because of your "Italian tune up". There are always exceptions, but modern engines need a little flat out driving to get eveything good and hot occasionally. The right question is not "should I get my engine to redline" but "how often do I need to get to redline?". If you have a Porsche or Miata, I would say that once your car is warm, you probably could never use redline too much. In general, the type of "abuse" that hurts a modern car is operating in high heat, with high power, for an extended period of time. Another problem you can get is oil starvation, some cars just cannot operate with high lateral loads and keep the oil underneath the pick up. All cars are capable of overheating, which I am certain is the most common cause of premature engine failure. As long as your car can stay cool in high performance driving, you are 100% guaranteed to crash before you get an engine failure.

 

[ekrampitzjr]

A good proxy for racing use is the effects of a conversion to aviation use for an auto engine. Until recent years, most failed miserably, with the more intelligently thought-out Mazda rotary conversions for aviation being a big exception.

Engines in light aircraft typically operate at much higher rpms constantly than those in a car loafing along at highway speeds in top gear. Sustained engine speeds of over 4000 rpm are typical in a light aircraft piston engine, but are highly unusual for most car drivers in most cars. Light aircraft engines must stay at or near their power peak to keep the plane in the air, which is the reason for such high rpms.

The old big-block Chevrolet and Ford V-8s originally had redlines around or just above 4000 rpm, if that tells you anything, and the small-block V-8s originally weren't much higher. This did not apply to highly modified racing engines, of course, but by definition racing engines aren't designed for long-term use and are usually regularly torn down and rebuilt.

In recent years, some of the most successful auto-to-aviation engine conversions besides the Mazda rotaries have been of relatively small fours. Subarus come to mind. That is probably because smaller engines work harder and can achieve higher revs anyway.

My guess would be that reasonable amounts of revving at or under the redline probably wouldn't harm the Ecotec, but sustained revving might be a different story. I would be more concerned with catalysts overheating at sustained high revs than in actual engine damage from the rpms themselves, as Mazda had to recall the 5 mini-minivan for ECU and exhaust mods after some doofus left the automatic tranny in second gear at highway speeds and overheated the exhaust, causing heat damage to the undercarriage and rear bumper cover. Just food for thought.

 

[windnsea00]

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Engines in light aircraft typically operate at much higher rpms constantly than those in a car loafing along at highway speeds in top gear. Sustained engine speeds of over 4000 rpm are typical in a light aircraft piston engine, but are highly unusual for most car drivers in most cars. Light aircraft engines must stay at or near their power peak to keep the plane in the air, which is the reason for such high rpms.

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It's interesting, in my 318ti averaging low 80mph I'm sitting at 4k rpms so that is a pretty typical place for me to be. When I drove up to nor.cal this past summer I was sitting at 5k rpms for a few hours straight (doing high 90's through the valley).