E-15 rule to be waived

[OFFRD]

The problem where I drive (IN, KY, TN) is that the pumps aren't marked. There is NO WAY that I'm aware of to have any idea what is being dispensed. I've never seen a sign that says "E15 with this selection" or "This fuel contains no ethanol". It's just impossible to know what you're actually getting.

I would love to find pure gasoline, or <E10, because it would increase fuel economy but I just have no way of finding it.

 

[ChrisMU]

The problem where I drive (IN, KY, TN) is that the pumps aren't marked. There is NO WAY that I'm aware of to have any idea what is being dispensed. I've never seen a sign that says "E15 with this selection" or "This fuel contains no ethanol". It's just impossible to know what you're actually getting.

I would love to find pure gasoline, or

Pure-gas app. Looks like there’s a few in your area. More pop up as you zoom in on the app

 

[K.Aoi]

The problem where I drive (IN, KY, TN) is that the pumps aren't marked. There is NO WAY that I'm aware of to have any idea what is being dispensed. I've never seen a sign that says "E15 with this selection" or "This fuel contains no ethanol". It's just impossible to know what you're actually getting.

I would love to find pure gasoline, or

E15 is always marked as Super 88 or E15. Nobody is selling E15 marked as regular 87. They usually have a separate nozzle for it as well. Same for Ethanol free, but why would you spend the extra money on it? The fuel economy gain you might get doesn't balance out the extra 50c/gallon it usually costs.

 

[OFFRD]

E15 is always marked as Super 88 or E15. Nobody is selling E15 marked as regular 87. They usually have a separate nozzle for it as well. Same for Ethanol free, but why would you spend the extra money on it? The fuel economy gain you might get doesn't balance out the extra 50c/gallon it usually costs.

I saw "Super 88" once. I was in southwestern PA and I stopped at a Sheetz station. I had no idea what Super 88 was so I had to Google it.

I was under the impression that the presidential order allows stations that used to all sell E10 to now sell E15? Is that not what happened? In other words, my assumption was that the stations here where I live could now be dispensing E15 without really saying so, because the presidential order allows that to happen due to the "fuel crisis".

 

[loneryder]

I see that the president is going to waive the EPA E-15 rule to allow wider distribution in an attempt to reduce fuel prices. I found it interesting that there is an argument that E15 will produce more smog in the summer. If this is the case then why does E10 or E85 reduce pollution. Or is it all just a gift to the big Ag Corp.

You answered your own question Sam. Still have your Motor Home?

 

[loneryder]

Considering that E15 isn't supposed to be used in vehicles older than 2001 or small or marine engines, I wonder how well that will work...

It's forbidden in my 15 MB by MB.

 

[loneryder]

Well I sure hope no one will be forced to go to E15 yet. But I also hope no one believes that ethanol is cheaper than gasoline. The consumer sees it at a lower price at the pump only because their tax dollars are subsidizing it. But the big problem I have (and its the first time I have heard anyone in the Media admit it) is that it actually causes MORE smog. So the Save the Environment call we were all told was the reason for E10 and the move for some to E85 and the costs associated with early adoption seems to be a boondoggle.

it actually causes MORE smog. This is why it wasn't supposed to be used in the summer. Now it can be.

 

[ChrisMU]

E15 is always marked as Super 88 or E15. Nobody is selling E15 marked as regular 87. They usually have a separate nozzle for it as well. Same for Ethanol free, but why would you spend the extra money on it? The fuel economy gain you might get doesn't balance out the extra 50c/gallon it usually costs.

I use E0 gas in my OPE and my (6) carbureted vehicles, as well as my (factory) fuel-injected ‘76 Coupe DeVille. For me, it’s about a longer storage life, not harming ethanol-sensitive parts, and more accurate fuel/air ratios… especially when you’re dealing with non-adjustable mixture carbs like later QuadraJets. The 2000, 2003, and ‘04 vehicles get e10.

 

[MNgopher]

I saw "Super 88" once. I was in southwestern PA and I stopped at a Sheetz station. I had no idea what Super 88 was so I had to Google it.

I was under the impression that the presidential order allows stations that used to all sell E10 to now sell E15? Is that not what happened? In other words, my assumption was that the stations here where I live could now be dispensing E15 without really saying so, because the presidential order allows that to happen due to the "fuel crisis".

That is a misinterpretation.

The order allows E15 to be sold in the summer when it traditionally was prohibited.

E15 still has to be labeled as such. Pumps that dispense it will have a rather large orange or yellow sticker on it stating it can only be used on 2001 and newer vehicles (which is by federal law/rule). No station can just start selling E15 and passing it off as regular 87. It doesn't work that way.

Don't believe me? Read to your hearts content -

EPA Issues Emergency Fuel Waiver for E15 Sales | US EPA

EPA News Release: EPA Issues Emergency Fuel Waiver for E15 Sales

www.epa.gov

and you can find the actual oders in there if you are so inclined...

 

[bunnspecial]

MTBE doesn't leak from underground storage tanks any easier than gasoline (or ethanol for that matter).

It is much more soluble in water than the other components of gasoline or ethanol

So, are you saying that a 5 carbon ether(which does not contain any O-H bonds) is more soluble in water than a 2 carbon alcohol(which contains an O-H bond)?

 

[Chris142]

The more alcohol they put in fuel the more problems we will see among with worse mpg. The more parts we have to buy and the more fuel we buy the more tax money they get.

 

[brianl703]

especially when you’re dealing with non-adjustable mixture carbs like later QuadraJets.

Aren't those feedback carbs with oxygen sensors?

 

[brianl703]

So, are you saying that a 5 carbon ether(which does not contain any O-H bonds) is more soluble in water than a 2 carbon alcohol(which contains an O-H bond)?

It's not so much the solubility as it is the fact that even a *tiny* amount of MTBE is enough to give water an unpleasant taste and smell.

 

[ChrisMU]

The specific vehicles I’m talking about are a 1984 Chevy C10 (owned 1999-2011) and 1985 GMC G2500 van. Neither had oxygen sensors. Both had the original carbs and exhaust (up to and including the cat). The GMC doesn’t have a cat anymore (exhaust was plugged up). I did read that ‘81-up GM cars may have had them… so it may have been a car vs. truck thing or be a California vs. non-California.

 

[JohnnyG]

It's not so much the solubility as it is the fact that even a *tiny* amount of MTBE is enough to give water an unpleasant taste and smell.

This ^ I also have it on good authority, a tanker driver in Colorado, that he hauled pure MTBE at one time. EVERY time he got to his destination, the load was short by several gallons. An investigation revealed that it was actually seeping through the welded seams of the tanker truck and evaporating. At one point it got so bad that he nearly passed out from the vapors (tailwind at the time) and had to pull off the highway and get to fresh air.
I used to pump barges with MTBE/gasoline mixture, and trust me when I say you don't want to mess with it.

 

[brianl703]

The specific vehicles I’m talking about are a 1984 Chevy C10 (owned 1999-2011) and 1985 GMC G2500 van. Neither had oxygen sensors. Both had the original carbs and exhaust (up to and including the cat). The GMC doesn’t have a cat anymore (exhaust was plugged up). I did read that ‘81-up GM cars may have had them… so it may have been a car vs. truck thing or be a California vs. non-California.

The '86 Camaro Z28 with a Quadrajet did have an oxygen sensor, though I think it was prone to running rich and clogging the cats due to carburetor problems regardless.

 

[JohnnyG]

Anyway, the last thing I read on this E15 business is that it will RAISE the price of gasoline by $.30/Gal.

 

[brianl703]

This ^ I also have it on good authority, a tanker driver in Colorado, that he hauled pure MTBE at one time. EVERY time he got to his destination, the load was short by several gallons. An investigation revealed that it was actually seeping through the welded seams of the tanker truck and evaporating. At one point it got so bad that he nearly passed out from the vapors (tailwind at the time) and had to pull off the highway and get to fresh air.
I used to pump barges with MTBE/gasoline mixture, and trust me when I say you don't want to mess with it.

I remember MTBE gas had had a strange smell to it. Like a harsh chemical smell is the best way I could describe it. They haven't sold MTBE gas in years and I still recall that smell.

 

[K.Aoi]

Anyway, the last thing I read on this E15 business is that it will RAISE the price of gasoline by $.30/Gal.

lolno, E15/super88 is usually 20-30c/gallon cheaper than regular 87.

 

[JohnnyG]

lolno, E15/super88 is usually 20-30c/gallon cheaper than regular 87.

Well, you know how it is, new rules, new prices!