Dilemma I Need help from the oil gods

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May 15, 2003
Henniker New Hampshire
Hi All,

I'm new so be gentle with me. A month ago I went and bought a 2002 Excursion with a V10 that was used as a rental. It had almost 21,000 miles on it when I got it. A friend turned me on to FTE which thru links I wound up here.

I can't get enough of this stuff!! I learn more everytime I come on. You guys are the bomb.

Anyway, I immediately changed the oil to M1 5w-30
with a fram double guard, you know the one with PTFE. This was before I started reading here. I promise I wont ever do it again and I won't buy Fram again honest.

Ran that oil for 3500, was nervous about the PTFE. My friend who is also a ford service manager starts giving me a hard time about the M1 5w-30. "It's not what ford specs yada yada yada" I found some M1 0w-20 last weekend and an M1 filter. I changed out the 5w-30 and put in the 0w-20 with the new filter. The truck seems to have lost about a 1/2 mile per gallon and seems a bit noisier.

I do short, I mean real short (2 miles) commute to work and tow the balloon trailer (2k lbs) on the weekends. I will do long hauls on occasion to balloon events 5000 mile RT to Billings MT in summer and 6000 mile round trip to Albuquerque in the fall.

So here's the dilemma: I want to change my oil out about every 5K I know I can longer but I just feel better about it. After reading about UOAs and VOAs I really like the M1 for strength, price and availability. I will use one of the better filters M1 or Pure One. Do I go with the 0w-20 and keep my friend / ford rep happy or do I go with the 5W-30 for piece of mind or maybe something else?


Ray in New Hampshire
My Balloon web page
WOW! 0W-20 in a V10?

If that were my truck, I'd use Amsoil 10W-40 in it. If I could only get Mobil 1, I'd run the 0W-40, or at least their 10W-30. If I were towing, I'd use the M1 15W-50 in summer, and 0W-40 in winter.

P.S.: I am NOT an oil God!

[ May 16, 2003, 03:58 PM: Message edited by: Ferrari ]
to a fellow Granite State resident from one north of the notch. Is it spring yet down in the "deep south"? Bummer about the Old Man of the Mountain taking a tumble isn't it?

I'd recommend the M1 5W-30 personally as I've had excellent luck in one vehicle with M1. Check the used oil analysis section too. This one is for a 2002 F-250 with the V10 http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000500#000000 Given those results, you might want to consider Motorcraft 5W-20 for the remainder of your warranty.


Do you ever go ballooning in the White Mountains? A number of years ago we had a bunch fly over our house in Littleton. My daughters and I enjoy watching the gliders take off from Franconia. It is such an eerie experience to listen to the whoosh of the gliders as they come back in for a landing. It must be so peaceful flying without the noise of an engine.

[ May 16, 2003, 04:39 PM: Message edited by: 2533a ]
Well as long as you are considering 5W-30 Mobil 1. I would consider the 10W-30 Mobil 1. It appears to hold up better than the 5W stuff. I personally would not use the 0W-20 but we have seen some good results with the 0W-20. If you are concerned with the warranty do an occasional analysis or purchase a case of the 0W-20 stuff- make a copy of the bill and then exchange it for some regular stuff. I would make sure I have the store some extra business for the inconvenience of exchanging the stuff.


Also its obvious that I am not an oil god-I am far to devious and dishonest.

Wouldn't the 5w flow better to the top of the engine? Even though it's not cold (sheesh thank god after last winter) doesn't the 5w flow better?

I understand the low Cst of the 30 wieght is close to a 20 so I don't think that will matter as much. I'm just concerned about that first jolt getting up on top as quick as possible.

With the price of these trucks I want to get this one right!

Ray in NH


I've never flown up in the north country except over in No Conway in December....Way to many trees

Welcome. I also landed here from FTE.

My recommendation would be to use the Motorcraft 5W-20 (and Motorcraft filter) until the end of warranty, but if 5W-30 M1 and any non-Fram filter works for you, go for it. 0W-XX scares me, unless you are in true arctic conditions. The Ford/Honda viscosity spec is for CAFE, not engine design.
If you need 5W-20 for the warranty, Motorcraft shows good analyses.

If you want a 5W-30, mail order Schaeffer's. It's worth the small amount of trouble, and has a higher viscosity than Mobil 1 and maybe even lower friction---and it does meet higher specs. Mobil 1 5&10W-30 are rated ACEA A1, the lowest, on the European specs, and Schaeffer 5&10W-30 are rated A3, the highest.

I'd go with what Ken and Al said, although you sound like you like the convienence of M1. I'd use Mobil 1 10w-30 in the summer, and 5w-30 in the brutal New Hamphshire winters. A 0w-40 is also fine in the summer months. Don't listen to anyone who says you have to run a 0w-20 in it. Ford changed this rule anyway I belive and said you can run a 30wt if you can't find the 20wt. It's all about fuel efficiency. I'm not oil god though, more like an oil wacko!

[ May 16, 2003, 07:15 PM: Message edited by: buster ]
Don’t concede to the leftist CAFÉ oil. Your engine will be better protected by a 5W-30 or 10W-30. M1 10W-30 flows about as well at low temp as their 5W-30, and seems to hold up better two. If you want to “trick” this oil out some, add about 1 oz of Schaeffer’s #132 Moly E.P. Oil Treatment per quart of M1 to beef up its additive package.

While there have been some acceptable used oil analyses of the newer 20 weight oils, it will be a long time before I’m convinced they will protect as well as the 30 or 40 weight oils. Incidentally, we are beginning to see a “trend” of higher lead is the UOA of these lightweight oils. I don’t believe they have the film strength to deal with heavy loads, and must rely instead of health does of barrier protection additives.

If the truck were mine, I’d run Amsoil 10W-30 ATM or Schaeffer’s #703. But that’s just me.
Molekule gave me this idea. Seems to work well and helps to quiet the additional noise my motor seems to emit when I run M1.
So do I yank the 20 now and bite the bullet or let it ride for 3k. The extra noise could that be because of the filter or the lighter oil.

Enquiring minds want to know

Imagine the oil in your engine is like a slippery mattress. The 0W20 and 5W20 are like a mattress the thickness of a sheet of wax paper. If you drop something on it it is going to hit hard and make alot of noise. The harmonics will also travel much easier as their is less damping. The 10W30, 15W50.... are like a thick plush pillow top. You drop something on it and you do not hear a thing and nothing gets hurt. I am imagineing that latter on they will find that harmonics are why out of whack with these light oils. Bearings do not live long if the crank harmonics are out of whack. Resisnoate(sp) freg.'s will break the molecular bonds of the bearing laminates the same way it breaks glass and all other elements. This same princpal is used in ultrasonic cleaners. If you can notice more noise that means more metal it is hiting more metal which is never good!
Prior to Fords cahnge to 5w20 in the 2001 model year or so, the V-10 used 5w30. Nothing has changed on the internals of the engine. Based on that, 5w30 would be AOK in this engine.

At the same time, the 5w20 results we have been seeing are encouraging, and none have had results that scream "5w20 is killing me".

If it were me, I'd leave the 0w20 in there for at least 3k, and have it tested to see where you are at. If you still don;t like any other changes (noises, fuel ecomomy, etc,) then the 5w30 will be just fine.

Originally posted by V10Ray:
So do I yank the 20 now and bite the bullet or let it ride for 3k. The extra noise could that be because of the filter or the lighter oil.

Enquiring minds want to know


Why not try adding some Schaeffer #132 oil suppliment to the current oil to see if it helps?
I think I am going to add the #132 to my son's Pontiac for the next oil change. I will then have a comparison of the 10W-30 TriSyn, 10W-30 SS, Delvac 1, and Delvac 1, with Moly (132)
. It would be good if we could get other comparisons of an oil with and without the #132. Also I'll be interested if the #132 stops the piston slap exhibited by this engine.

[ May 17, 2003, 08:04 AM: Message edited by: Al ]

Originally posted by Ferrari:
WOW! 0W-20 in a V10?

If that were my truck, I'd use Amsoil 10W-40 in it. If I could only get Mobil 1, I'd run the 0W-40, or at least their 10W-30. If I were towing, I'd use the M1 15W-50 in summer, and 0W-40 in winter.


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