Dealer Fill 0W20, 9,574 miles, 18 Lexus GS350

chinee

chinee

Joined
Mar 4, 2003
Messages
229
Location
Wellington, Florida
Okay, here we go...

Dealer fill in this 2018 Lexus GS350, I assume to be 0W20 TGMO, in a typically very reliable 3.5L V6 that's been around a long time. 9,574 miles on the oil, but it was in there for 19 months... never left oil in use for such a long period before. As Blackstone states, Iron, Copper and Silicon levels are raising the roof. ^^^

Replaced with Pennzoil Platinum 0W20 and using the K&N cartridge filter, thinking of changing this fill at 7,500 miles. Also slapped on a fumoto valve.

Any feedback out there? Things I should have done differently? Recommendations?

18 GS350 Mar 2021 redacted.jpg
 
That looks like a lot of wear for a Toyota,which always have zero to single digit wear metals. I wonder if a W30 and a shorter oci would lower the metals? I'd think the engine should be well broken in at almost 20K,but I may be completely wrong on all counts.
 
Break-in wear. Still haven't rinsed out the FIPG used everywhere, or the initial wear-in metals.

I would change the oil/filter every 5k miles or EVERY year, whichever comes 1st.

And, in Florida, use a full synthetic 30 grade. No need for a 20 grade in that climate. Unless you live in the colder northern parts of town.... which might be chilly compared to the southern parts of town.

Why the KN? Absolute garbage KN marketing with no real info. I'd use a Supertech or Fram before KN!
 
Concur with recommendations to step up to a 30 grade.

Absolutely zero reason to use a 20 grade in Florida. The 20 grade recommendation is only an attempt to raise Toyota's corporate fuel economy average to meet CAFE.

In Florida, a nice full-synth 10W-30, at least, depending on how you drive it, would be ideal, if you want to get an off-the-shelf oil. You mentioned that you used PPPP 0W-20; the 10W-30 formulation is excellent, with extremely good Noack score, and has very little viscosity modifiers, which will result in a very clean engine. Its HTHS is around 3.1. If you prefer something thicker, the Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 10W-30 is 3.3 HTHS, which is knocking on the door of the Euro 30 grades, which start at 3.5 HTHS.

If you like to drive aggressively and redline it frequently, then, consider something like a Euro 5W-30 with a bit higher HTHS value.

Both of the oils I mentioned above are on my radar for this summer for the wife's 4Runner.
 
john_pifer said:
Concur with recommendations to step up to a 30 grade.

Absolutely zero reason to use a 20 grade in Florida. The 20 grade recommendation is only an attempt to raise Toyota's corporate fuel economy average to meet CAFE.

In Florida, a nice full-synth 10W-30, at least, depending on how you drive it, would be ideal, if you want to get an off-the-shelf oil. You mentioned that you used PPPP 0W-20; the 10W-30 formulation is excellent, with extremely good Noack score, and has very little viscosity modifiers, which will result in a very clean engine. Its HTHS is around 3.1. If you prefer something thicker, the Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 10W-30 is 3.3 HTHS, which is knocking on the door of the Euro 30 grades, which start at 3.5 HTHS.

If you like to drive aggressively and redline it frequently, then, consider something like a Euro 5W-30 with a bit higher HTHS value.

Both of the oils I mentioned above are on my radar for this summer for the wife's 4Runner.
Click to expand...
Except that's what the manufacturer recommends.

10W-30? Is it 1989? No manufacturer recommends 10W-30 anymore, 5W-30 would be the better substitute.
 
stchman said:
Except that's what the manufacturer recommends.

10W-30? Is it 1989? No manufacturer recommends 10W-30 anymore, 5W-30 would be the better substitute.
Click to expand...
I stated above why Toyota suggests 0W-20.

Most of their vehicles’ owners manuals also include a line that allows the use of a thicker grade under more serious use.

I like 10W-30 oils because they typically have lower amounts of viscosity-modifying polymers than their 5W-30 counterparts, and that means a cleaner engine, as well as less shear - it’ll stay in grade better.

AND almost always have better Noack scores.

And the difference in viscosity is very often negligible until you get down to some pretty cold temps, which the OP won’t often see down in Florida.

If you’re ignoring 10W-30s because 5W-30s are more popular these days, or, you think “they’re from 1989”, you’re doing yourself and your vehicle a disservice, in my opinion.
 
Indeed, your silicon numbers could be from the gasket material used in manufacturing, an unsealed air box and if you live near the beach in FL and any other combo you can think of. The fact that your iron & copper are high is due to the engine braking in. As others have mentioned on such a newer engine, go fewer miles between OCIs and a 30 grade probably wouldn't hurt in your climate.
 
This is a new engine and an example of why UOA's on new engines can be problematic. Wear is supposed to be higher. Doesn't Toyota recommend 10k miles OR 1 year for oil changes with a 5k "severe service" interval?

I see no point in worrying about grade. This is a low speed grocery-getter in Florida. 20w is fine assuming it's what Toyota spec'd. Of course you could run a 30w but why? Cheaper?. This UOA isn't telling you much because it was a new engine.
 
chinee said:
Okay, here we go...

Dealer fill in this 2018 Lexus GS350, I assume to be 0W20 TGMO, in a typically very reliable 3.5L V6 that's been around a long time. 9,574 miles on the oil, but it was in there for 19 months... never left oil in use for such a long period before. As Blackstone states, Iron, Copper and Silicon levels are raising the roof. ^^^

Replaced with Pennzoil Platinum 0W20 and using the K&N cartridge filter, thinking of changing this fill at 7,500 miles. Also slapped on a fumoto valve.

Any feedback out there? Things I should have done differently? Recommendations?
Click to expand...
Why was the oil in for two years I'm sure toyota/lexux recommends 1 year MAX oil change interval?
But that is not the issue this is break in oil it should have been out by around 5K miles +/-.

And light 30 grade may do well in there but with DEXOS good luck finding a thin one. Plus I dont know the VVTi porgramming may no tolerate a near 50% increase in KV100.

Maybe a quality 5W20 would be a good compromise. they tend to be knocking on the door of a 30 vs. a 0W20 which is about 10 cst thinner at KV40.
- Ken
 
john_pifer said:
I stated above why Toyota suggests 0W-20.

Most of their vehicles’ owners manuals also include a line that allows the use of a thicker grade under more serious use.

I like 10W-30 oils because they typically have lower amounts of viscosity-modifying polymers than their 5W-30 counterparts, and that means a cleaner engine, as well as less shear - it’ll stay in grade better.

AND almost always have better Noack scores.

And the difference in viscosity is very often negligible until you get down to some pretty cold temps, which the OP won’t often see down in Florida.

If you’re ignoring 10W-30s because 5W-30s are more popular these days, or, you think “they’re from 1989”, you’re doing yourself and your vehicle a disservice, in my opinion.
Click to expand...
JP,
I never found a good running 10W30 back 20 years ago when 5W30 was considered thin, Except Rotella T Triple Protect: the greatest all purpose oil around. Cant find the stuff anymore and I don't like the SS version.
Does ANYTHING spec a 10W30?

I don't see anyone subjecting their everyday car to serious use.
They barely make it through the traffic light at 25 mph!

I could see in a HD truck with mountainous towing where it would be dandy - or some challenging rock crawling in your 4x4
- Ken
 
If me and in FL I would see no worry about moving to a 5-30 synthetic. If it were mine, here in the Northeast I'd be a ok with 5-20 or a 0-20 in that engine. As stated above, I would be leaning to 5k OCI with a new filter just to get it broken in. This last statement is irrelevant to the weight oil you choose. After say 2 5k's I'd do another UOA and if things settled down, move on to 7500 OCI.
 
Looks like this was the second oil change and 7 mos. overdue. I would go 6 mos./5k miles on this interval max to help flush things out. Even 3 mos or 2500 miles wouldn’t be a waste here. The first owner prob leased it and the FF was in there 2 or 3 years so it needs some short/frequent oil changes. A few of them and then it should be fine. I’d run two short intervals of Supertech full syn.
 
All you're measuring here is where you're improving from, those values won't stabilize until you hit 40k or so. If you're under 20,000 miles on the motor, none of those values can really tell you very much, as everything is still wearing in. It's not even worth the K&N or whatever super premium oil filter you're putting on there.

OE Toyota, Denso FTF will take your engine as many miles as you like.

Technically 19 months is too long, but really it's because of the likelihood of the engine being short-tripped and the chemistry of that, the oil otherwise would have plenty of the qualities you need it to have remaining. Ignore the thin-oil luddites too - hurr-durr it's the Internet. Quality oil matters a lot more than viscosity.
 
The report says "The 2.5 TBN shows active additive in reserve".
Good. But it is kind of pointless if test for TAN wasn't done.
UOA is useful, but in the absence of VOA for given oil you have nothing to compare it to.

For example.
If the percentage depletion rate of TBN in UOA approaching 50% or more from fresh oil the TAN starts to rapidly rise.
So, if one does not requests test for TAN at least look at the TBN in UOA and compare it to TBN of fresh oil. If you see a drop of 50% or more it's time for OC. I have seen UOA with TBN 1.2 and lab said you can go x amount of miles more. Hmmm...

I looked at couple recent Toyota 0W-20 oils VOA.
0W-20 AFE
TBN = 7.72
TAN = 1.58

0W-20 SN+
TBN = 9.21
TAN = 1.87

If 2.5 TBN reserve in UOA of above tested oils the drop in TBN would be:
AFE 68% drop in TBN
SN+ 73% drop in TBN
 
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