Crankshaft Position Sensor Update...Issues still!

[charbaby]

Update on the Crank Position Sensor:

Was out with my wife this afternoon and the engine is starting long again. Ran out to Home Depot for some plumming supplies for an in home project that we're doing and a bit of shopping and then out for a bite to eat. Started fine first time today(about 1pm). And then each time that we shut off the engine and stopped to shop or eat, the Altima took "that long time" to restart just as it did prior to replacing the sensors(replaced both cam/crank p/s). It was fine all week until now...No, "Service Engine Soon" light on the dash.
HMMMMM! Im really stumped!

 

[charbaby]

As stated earlier, I replaced both the cam/crank position sensors with the new updated version(round metal ends). The car had a recall several years ago in which I had gone the the dealer for a reflash on the ECU/ECM or something like that. The dealer said they had to reprogram the(I can't quite remember)the cam or the crank position sensor. I'd have to find the receipt/workorder in my glove box and read what they said.

 

[crazyoildude]

Can you scan it i know there is no ckeck engine light but sometimes there is a code and the light wont come on
that happened to me more times than i can remember

 

[Trav]

I don't know about Nissan but on my scan tool under advanced Nissan it has relearn crank/cam position sensor in the menu.
Maybe a trip to the dealer to get it done is in order if you don't have the equipment.

 

[StevieC]

Maybe something is breaking down under heat or you have fuel pressure bleeding away... Do we know everything else is fine before we start pointing at these sensors?

 

[charbaby]

Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
Can you scan it i know there is no ckeck engine light but sometimes there is a code and the light wont come on
that happened to me more times than i can remember


Yes, I can run over to AAP and have them do it.

Originally Posted By: Trav
I don't know about Nissan but on my scan tool under advanced Nissan it has relearn crank/cam position sensor in the menu. Maybe a trip to the dealer to get it done is in order if you don't have the equipment.


I'll ask at AAP if their scan tool has that "advanced" feature. I thought the by disconnecting the battery for as long as I had, that it would have started the relearning process on it's own. Although the the whole crank sensor job took me about 6 hours, I had the battery disconnected for over 24 hours between July 4th & 5th. Started the job on the 4th, stopped & cleaned up, went to party, finished the job on the 5th.

Originally Posted By: StevieC
Maybe something is breaking down under heat or you have fuel pressure bleeding away... Do we know everything else is fine before we start pointing at these sensors?


I'll check out my work first and make sure everything is clipped on properly. Althought I made sure of this before I buttoned up the job, I was soooooooo careful because I didn't want to do this job any time soon, I really took my time and was very thorough. Then I'll take the car in for a code scan and work from there. I may have fuel pump pressurs problems or injector problems. I may have to take it in for diagnosis.

 

[Trav]

AAP just uses a generic OBD II code scanner not a scan tool so it wont have the advanced features that are manufacturer specific.I bought the Nissan module for my unit because i own an Infiniti.
To be honest i dont know if disconnecting the battery on the Nissan clears the ecm or not,on my Infiniti it has a backup memory that holds for a long time.I had a CEL and after the repairs it was still on even after the battery had been disconnected for a long while.

I had to clear it then use the relearn mode.
There are manufacturer specific codes that will not trip the CEL or even show up on a generic code scanner but will show up on an advanced scan tool.

 

[StevieC]

I was just thinking it may not be anything related to what you did and just coincidental that it went away for a while after you did your work and it was actually some other problem which just reappeared.

Double check your work though...

 

[charbaby]

Well guys, I went to AAP and had another code scan. It showed nothing. The car started and ran fine yesterday(no hard/long starts). The running around town I was doing may not have been the same as other times. Maybe the engine needs to be really HOT!

But, last Sept. 09 and for a short period of time there after, I was experiencing long starts when running around town and doing many restarts after going from(for example) store to store and being in each store for > 30 min. Normaly when I start the engine in the morning it's fine and it's fine in the afternoon or evening. But when restarting, oh, let's say, every 30 minutes or so, the engine would take several seconds to start. It was fine all winter long no matter how I would drive, right up until July this year. And like I mentioned, yesterday, things were fine. I'm starting to beleive the there is some fuel pump issues or fuel pump pressure regulator issues. When I finish the projects around the house, I'll attend to the car.

Trav, there is no more CEL/SES light on the dash and there hasn't been since I reconnected the battery although, I do beleive the engine needs to be seriously checked out in "real time"(if that's the correct wording). I'll get this done soon, meaning sometime during the summer.

SteveC. I went through and checked my connections and all were fine. But, that's when the engine started fine and stayed that way during the day. I could go into alot of details about how I worked on the sensors and how meticulous and thorough I was. The engine has always started fine the first time during the day and when it sits for long periods of time(hours). It's the repeated restarts where she get LLLOOONNNGGG! And then it catches! But this is only recently.

For the sake of elimination, I pulled the spark plugs. All four plugs looked the same and just the way I want plugs to look...Happy there! The coil-on-plug(s) all looked fine as well as did the boots going into the cylinders. And down into the cylinders all looked nice and clean...Happy there too!

 

[Smoky14]

I don't know how exposed your sensors are, but to trouble shoot I carry a spray bottle of water along and spray water on the sensor, or close by, one at a time and see if it makes a difference. Sometimes a slight cooling will made them start right away. Bad sensors are becoming common place.

Smoky

 

[charbaby]

Originally Posted By: Smoky14
I don't know how exposed your sensors are, but to trouble shoot I carry a spray bottle of water along and spray water on the sensor, or close by, one at a time and see if it makes a difference. Sometimes a slight cooling will made them start right away. Bad sensors are becoming common place.

Smoky


What sensors are you refering too? If it's the sensors that I just replaced(cam/crank), these sensors are protected from water exposure for the most part. But when replacing them last week, I used a good helping of dielectrical lube as an extra precaution.

 

[flanso]

Originally Posted By: Char Baby

I'm starting to beleive the there is some fuel pump issues or fuel pump pressure regulator issues.


Look for an easy-to-access connection on the fuel rail and loosen the connection very slightly with the engine off. Fuel, under pressure, should squirt out. If there appears to be no residual pressure, the long crank time is probably fuel related; perhaps a leaky injector.

 

[charbaby]

Originally Posted By: flanso
Originally Posted By: Char Baby

I'm starting to beleive the there is some fuel pump issues or fuel pump pressure regulator issues.


Look for an easy-to-access connection on the fuel rail and loosen the connection very slightly with the engine off. Fuel, under pressure, should squirt out. If there appears to be no residual pressure, the long crank time is probably fuel related; perhaps a leaky injector.


Flanso, thank you.
The engine always starts fine on the first start of the day and if it's been sitting awhile(hours). It's the 10 mile drive, shutdown(sit for 30 min or there abouts) that it takes a couple of seconds to restart. I'd have to try this after a decent drive and a 30 min shutdown.

 

[Ray Garlington]

What you are describing is sometimes caused by a fuel injector that does not close completely. When you turn off the engine, fuel continues to drip into the manifold, thereby flooding the engine.

You can test this by doing the 10 mile drive, shutdown, then immediately try to restart. It should start easily. If you then wait your 30 minutes and it balks, you likely have one or more leaking injectors.

An easy way to re-pressurize your fuel rail is to find your fuel pump relay and jump it so that the fuel pump runs for a few seconds. Then reinstall the relay. When you go to start the car, the fuel rail will be pressurized, but the engine will still be flooded (so you should still get the balky-start situation.

 

[flanso]

Originally Posted By: Char Baby

The engine always starts fine on the first start of the day and if it's been sitting awhile(hours). It's the 10 mile drive, shutdown(sit for 30 min or there abouts) that it takes a couple of seconds to restart. I'd have to try this after a decent drive and a 30 min shutdown.

Char Baby, Engine temperature actually rises for several minutes after you shut down a hot engine. When you restart the hot engine after thirty minutes, the fuel pressure in the fuel rail is actually higher than when you start the engine cold. That incremental increase in fuel pressure, from heat, may be causing an injector to leak or one of the system's check valves to bleed. The longer hot cranking time may be from the fuel pump taking time to restore pressure in the fuel rail.

 

[charbaby]

Originally Posted By: Ray Garlington
What you are describing is sometimes caused by a fuel injector that does not close completely. When you turn off the engine, fuel continues to drip into the manifold, thereby flooding the engine.

You can test this by doing the 10 mile drive, shutdown, then immediately try to restart. It should start easily. If you then wait your 30 minutes and it balks, you likely have one or more leaking injectors.

An easy way to re-pressurize your fuel rail is to find your fuel pump relay and jump it so that the fuel pump runs for a few seconds. Then reinstall the relay. When you go to start the car, the fuel rail will be pressurized, but the engine will still be flooded (so you should still get the balky-start situation.



This is exactly what is does RAY G. The engine will start right away after a shutdown but will take longer after setting awhile)30min).

 

[ArmandJones]

Have you ever tried to change the (removed non site sponsor link) with the different brands out there in the market? Try to see also if there are issues with other car parts installed in your car. If not, just try to find ways to really have it done with good condition.

 

[charbaby]

Armand,
I beleive you are refering to me as it's been 1 1/2 weeks since I visited this particular post.

I have installe the new redesigned sensors which have metal ends instead of plastic and the electrical mounting clip and mounting hold down bolt have been moved 180 deg to the other side for easier removal/installation.

As far as other parts being installed in my Altima, these are the only parts thus far that have been replaced since new, the car has been great so far.

Earlier in this section, I have described the parts that I have replace(cam and crank position sensors, both being the same part#), the difficulty I had during the replacement, how the car was acting etc.

The long starting issue that Im experiencing now I beleive, has something to do with the fuel pump/regulator or injector(s). Otherwise, the engine runs great with great power at all RPM's, just the way it should be.