Cost to Repair a Honda V6 Engine that Jumps Time

Messages
24,171
Location
CA
Background: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/5098716/lapping-valves-vs-machining I recently repaired a 2006 Accord V6 with 149K that jumped time while idling. This is an interference engine which means the valves will collide with the pistons if the timing belt breaks (or if the engine goes out of time for another reason). No piston damage occurred. Just wanted to share how much it can cost to repair one if this situation happens. The book time to remove both cylinder heads is 9 hours.
Code
Brand	Quantity	Part Number	Description	List Price	Total
Genuine Honda	2	12251-RCA-A01	Cylinder Head Gasket	56.42	112.84
	12	12210-PZ1-004	Valve Stem Seal - Intake	2.15	25.80
	12	12211-PZ1-004	Valve Stem Seal - Exhaust	2.15	25.80
	5	14721-P8E-A00	Valve, Exhaust	29.13	145.65
	4	14711-P8E-A00	Valve, Intake	18.88	75.52
	2	91213-RKG-003	Camshaft Oil Seal	8.73	17.46
	1	91212-5MR-A01	Crankshaft Oil Seal	9.12	9.12
	6	91301-PLC-000	Fuel Injector O-Ring (upper)	2.77	16.62
	6	91302-PNA-003	Fuel Injector O-Ring (lower)	2.15	12.90
	1	91301-P2F-A01	Fuel Rail O-Ring	2.82	2.82
	1	17065-RCA-A01	Lower Intake Manifold Gasket - Rear	19.7	19.70
	1	17055-RCA-A01	Lower Intake Manifold Gasket - Front	19.7	19.70
	1	18715-PB2-000	EGR Valve Gasket	10.37	10.37
	2	91314-PH7-003	Coolant Pipe O-Ring	3.1	6.20
	1	19411-P8A-A03	Water Passage Gasket, Front	5.3	5.30
	1	19412-P8A-A02	Water Passage Gasket, Rear	2.6	2.60
	1	19421-RCA-A60	Hose A, Warmer (ATF) - Split during removal	3.4	3.40
	1	19501-RCA-A00	Upper Radiator Hose 	21.95	21.95
	1	19502-RCA-A00	Lower Radiator Hose	28.73	28.73
	4	19511-PH7-003	Radiator Hose Clamp	7.95	31.80
	2	18115-RCA-A01	Gasket, Exhaust Chamber	6.17	12.34
	2	12341-RCA-A01	Valve Cover Gasket	10.5	21.00
	1	90704-RCA-A00	Crankshaft Sprocket Key	5.95	5.95
	1	15400-PLM-A02	Oil Filter	7.3	7.30
	1	19301-P8E-A10	Thermostat Assembly	64.33	64.33
Fel-Pro	2	ES71329-1	Cylinder Head Bolt Set	23.79	47.58
	1	MS96410	Upper Intake Manifold Gasket Set	19.49	19.49
CCI MFG	2	128524/168	Super Extended Life Coolant - Blue	11.66	23.32
Mobil 1	1		Mobil 1 5W-20 Full Synthetic, 5-qt.	22.88	22.88
NGK	6	6994	IZFR6K11 Laser Iridium Spark Plug	8.20	49.20
Aisin	1	TKH002	Timing Belt Kit w/WP and Hyd Tensioner	178.78	178.78
Bando	1	6PK2135	Serpentine Drive Belt	20.55	20.55
					
			Subtotal		1067.00
			Tax		93.36
			Machine Shop Charge (3-angle cut valve job and resurface heads)		540.00
			Grand Total		1700.36
In comparison, a used engine with 67k miles was $1200. The cost of the necessary gaskets, a new timing belt kit, hoses, coolant, oil, etc is about $550. So in this situation the parts cost was comparable but the labor time to swap an engine would have been slightly higher. We decided to repair the engine since the engine was working fine before this happened, but it may not always make the most financial sense. Point is, it is possible to repair a Honda V6 engine if it jumps time, but try to avoid the situation if you can. wink2 Photos of the job and of the bent valves can be found below.

IMG_5445.jpg


IMG_5476.jpg


IMG_5469.jpg


IMG_5470.jpg
 

The Critic

Thread starter
Messages
24,171
Location
CA
Originally Posted by ctechbob
Any idea on the cause? Broken belt or deferred maintenance?
It was user error. grin During an oil leak diagnosis, the engine was accidentally allowed to run without the crank pulley being installed. Clearly this was a terrible idea since the crank sprocket is keyed to the crankshaft.
 
Last edited:
Messages
2,967
Location
pa
have $$$$ echeaper than a malfunction of any kind on a 1.8T 20 valve earlier VW or Audi! anything that malfunctions in the timing system can ffects. possibly a worn belt could have jumped a tooth or two, even chain driven systems can have issues as they are tensioned with a tensioner. girlfriends 99 low mile malibu needed a water pump that was in the block, removing everything to install included compressing the tensioner plunger, it did not fully release after install + enging idled poorly needing a replacement tensioner to cure. likely not interference fit, but not sure. many owners are blind to the needs + issues of modern engines until the poo hits the fan $$$$, pay some now ot trade often or pay more later!!!
 
Messages
6,696
Location
New England
Originally Posted by slacktide_bitog
I HATE timing belts, especially on interference engines mad But I like the pics smile
I read Honda and was thinking a stretched timing chain from oil neglect or wear. That happens too.
 
Messages
2,167
Location
missouri
Do you ever have problems with oil burning after removing the heads. I have not had to do this sort of repair in over 40 years, it was a problem then. It happens when the friction lock between the head and block gets broken and due to core shifts the bore is no longer round. With seated rings and crosshatch, the engine can not reseal. Rod
 
Messages
1,514
Location
Ohio
Originally Posted by slacktide_bitog
I HATE timing belts, especially on interference engines mad But I like the pics smile
I'll gladly take the timing belt on my Pilot over the troublesome timing chains I had on my Traverse. At least the belt is designed to be replaced without pulling the engine first. The cost of replacing the chains on the Traverse is typically around $3000.
 
Messages
2,584
Location
wv
IMHO not worth it. One of my family members had same year accord. Had a few issues with A/C pumps, then trans started slipping despite frequent fluid changes. K24 cars were ok..
 
Messages
18,179
Location
NH
Interesting. I would have guessed higher for the bill. Not that I'd want to foot the bill either way!
 
Messages
4,161
Location
Texas
I think I would have chosen the used engine . But different strokes for different folks . Would also depend on how much faith I had in the mechanic vs. how much faith I had in the salvage yard . I am too old and stiff to do it myself & lack the place to do it & some of the tooling .
 
Messages
7,786
Location
Oklahoma
If it just jumped time, why don't just put in a new timing belt? If that engine got damaged, you'd know it right away. Sounds like it was still running OK, just jumping time meaning belt lost a tooth or stretched or something.
 
Messages
26,146
Location
MA, Mittelfranken.de
Originally Posted by madRiver
Originally Posted by slacktide_bitog
I HATE timing belts, especially on interference engines mad But I like the pics smile
I read Honda and was thinking a stretched timing chain from oil neglect or wear. That happens too.
Timing belts and chains do not stretch they only wear.
 
Messages
583
Location
st louis, mo
Originally Posted by Trav
Originally Posted by madRiver
Originally Posted by slacktide_bitog
I HATE timing belts, especially on interference engines mad But I like the pics smile
I read Honda and was thinking a stretched timing chain from oil neglect or wear. That happens too.
Timing belts and chains do not stretch they only wear.
What does "stretch" mean? I've seen others make this distinction, but I think it's unhelpful. If you want to get technical enough, everything stretches...
 
Messages
6,494
Location
Connecticut
Originally Posted by The Critic
Originally Posted by ctechbob
Any idea on the cause? Broken belt or deferred maintenance?
It was user error. grin During an oil leak diagnosis, the engine was accidentally allowed to run without the crank pulley being installed. Clearly this was a terrible idea since the crank sprocket is keyed to the crankshaft.
duh
 
Top