Comparison List of UOAs (Blackstone v. Wix v. Amsoil v. TestOil v. WearCheck)

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OK.... The title should have actually read "Blackstone v. Wix / NAPA v. Amsoil / Polaris / Oil Analyzers v. TestOil v. WearCheck Mob 1 v. WearCheck Mob 2", but I obviously didn't have room to be so proper. Anyway, I have filled out this spreadsheet as much as I could.... https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/14JwFZGyYOS801DvL95kKzKcuhjF5gQ6MjcSxHcwIajI/edit?usp=sharing ... but there are a couple snags where I've filled in with question marks "????" because I'm not quite sure if it's included in the main cost, or if it's extra, or if they only show data if something is detected or necessary to mention it. For example, I see a sample WearCheck Mob 2 report, and it includes both TBN *and* TAN, however, there's other verbage on their website that makes it seem like if you send them your engine oil, they'll only give you the TBN and *not* the TAN. If you guys could help me with the following: - Fill in the blanks that currently have "????" - Correct things that are actually different from your own reports - For example, does your test actually provide both KV40 and KV100 in the standard test (or is it extra $$) ----- Even tho the Wix test and NAPA tests are the same, I saw a sample NAPA Report that included KV40, whereas the Wix one was blank - Also, does your test actually provide both TBN and TAN in the standard test (or is it extra $$) - Inform me of any other features of the test that actually cost extra $$ from the standard cost - Explain to me what the "Antiwear" tests provided by TestOil and WearCheck are actually testing - Inform me of the prices of the TestOil and both of the WearCheck tests ... that would be awesome!!! The TestOil and WearCheck tests seem so much better than Blackstone's tests on paper, plus they even use more accurate fuel dilution and TBN testing. It blows my mind that Blackstone Labs is still so commonly recommended here. The only real "unique selling advantage" that they have over the others is the Flash Point test. That's it. Other than that, they definitely wouldn't be my first choice.
 
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TestOil is around $40 for a single sample but includes particle counts. If you had them set up through work and did a significant number of samples per month they do volume pricing. I wouldn't knock BlackStone so quickly and harshly just on just their fuel dilution; we have plenty of UOAs from numerous labs AND testimony from industry insiders that fuel most likely isn't anywhere near the death knell for an engine some would like to believe it to be. The UOA numbers just don't bear out that fuel is causing catastrophic wear. Plus, the methods that TestOil, Wearchek etc. use is only accurate up to about 7%.... flashpoint is at least as good an indicator of fuel as the "actual" reading. Blackstone does do some things that no other lab does, namely universal averages that are separated by each engine type and size, and are more than happy to provide all of the data for your engine if you ask for it. Just like dnewton3 has a file of thousands of UOAs he's looked at, I called up Blackstone and later that day had the history of all 2,000+ samples run on the 2.5 MZR in Fusions so I could look at the larger data picture. Is Blackstone the cheapest? No way. But cost is not everything. Blackstone has turned around every single sample in one business day of the 40+ I've sent them over the years. Drop sample off on Sunday, have results Monday afternoon. Even TestOil took 4 days for turnaround. Sometimes speed is of the utmost importance, and on that Blackstone delivers in spades. (Just not the USPS on the "free" shipping containers.)
 
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Just an FYI, A Blackstone particle count is only an additional $15 if done at the same time as a UOA. The test price list does show the particle count at $25, but that is the cost if no other testing is done.
 
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AtomicNumber53

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Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
TestOil is around $40 for a single sample but includes particle counts. If you had them set up through work and did a significant number of samples per month they do volume pricing.
Does that $40 include return shipping or no?
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
I wouldn't knock BlackStone so quickly and harshly just on just their fuel dilution; we have plenty of UOAs from numerous labs AND testimony from industry insiders that fuel most likely isn't anywhere near the death knell for an engine some would like to believe it to be. The UOA numbers just don't bear out that fuel is causing catastrophic wear. Plus, the methods that TestOil, Wearchek etc. use is only accurate up to about 7%.... flashpoint is at least as good an indicator of fuel as the "actual" reading. Blackstone does do some things that no other lab does, namely universal averages that are separated by each engine type and size, and are more than happy to provide all of the data for your engine if you ask for it. Just like dnewton3 has a file of thousands of UOAs he's looked at, I called up Blackstone and later that day had the history of all 2,000+ samples run on the 2.5 MZR in Fusions so I could look at the larger data picture. Is Blackstone the cheapest? No way. But cost is not everything. Blackstone has turned around every single sample in one business day of the 40+ I've sent them over the years. Drop sample off on Sunday, have results Monday afternoon. Even TestOil took 4 days for turnaround. Sometimes speed is of the utmost importance, and on that Blackstone delivers in spades. (Just not the USPS on the "free" shipping containers.)
True that. I compiled a list of motorcycle oils, and it became apparent to me that the oils with the lower flash point were the weaker choices. Wish the other ones would add that test, and then they'd pretty much be perfect.
 
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AtomicNumber53

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Originally Posted by shanneba
Just an FYI, A Blackstone particle count is only an additional $15 if done at the same time as a UOA. The test price list does show the particle count at $25, but that is the cost if no other testing is done.
Excellent. Corrected! Also... If someone could post their NAPA, TestOil, and WearCheck reports, that might help us out. There's plenty of Blackstone & Oil Analyzer reports, but not enough of the others.
 
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Consider modifying to reflect that Blackstone doesn't measure fuel dilution, and that at least Polaris and TO do measure it via GC (gas chromtography). This is an important distinction to some, including me where Blackstone mislead me on certain engines saying they had TR or <0.5% when they indeed had 5-10% + fuel. BS does not measure fuel. Instead, they guess based on flashpoint (and are usual way off as we know). Also, flashpoint is a very subjective and imprecise, and was never designed to provide a fuel percentage. Seems odd to have a fuel row, and have BS checked. BS does much worse than not measure fuel - they provide incorrect fuel numbers which mislead customers. So, consider changing the fuel row to "fuel GC" (GC is the ASTM way to measure fuel), and then checking the boxes for only the labs that use GC such as Polaris, TO, and whomever else does.
 
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One of the labs (I forget if it was Polaris or TestOil) said that even GC is not accurate at rates higher than 5%... going back to my original point that flashpoint is as good a tool as any of these questionable results, if it's even valid. SonOfJoe even doubts fuel is an issue as long as the oil isn't thinned out to the point that it causes metal-to-metal contact.
 

AtomicNumber53

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Just received a response from someone with WearCheck. Apparently their Mob 2 UOA only includes ONE of the 4 or 5 features mentioned in the spreadsheet for that extra $10 cost. Kinda makes it irrelevant, since only the Particle Count costs $10. Might just remove the Mob 2 option unless my understanding is incorrect. By far, the WearCheck PQ index is one of the better features offered on a UOA Lab. It certainly seems better than looking at ppm alone!! See here for more info: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/2090404/1 EDIT: It looks like you're not able to test for TAN/TBN or Particle Count unless you go with the Mob 2 test, according to these documents: - https://wearcheck.com/mob1.html - https://wearcheck.com/mob2.html
 
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AtomicNumber53

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Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
One of the labs (I forget if it was Polaris or TestOil) said that even GC is not accurate at rates higher than 5%... going back to my original point that flashpoint is as good a tool as any of these questionable results, if it's even valid. SonOfJoe even doubts fuel is an issue as long as the oil isn't thinned out to the point that it causes metal-to-metal contact.
I think that
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
One of the labs (I forget if it was Polaris or TestOil) said that even GC is not accurate at rates higher than 5%... going back to my original point that flashpoint is as good a tool as any of these questionable results, if it's even valid. SonOfJoe even doubts fuel is an issue as long as the oil isn't thinned out to the point that it causes metal-to-metal contact.
Meh.... it seems like several of Blackstone's tests are the "lesser quality ones". Fuel GC it is!!
 
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So does the $34 Polaris/Amsoil do fuel GC plus all that Blackstone does, including list previous test for trend comparison? I've been using Blackstone for a while now, but also now have several GDI engines, two of which are notorious "oil makers". ( EcoBoost and Yamaha F300 outboard )
 
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Originally Posted by noclutch
So does the $34 Polaris/Amsoil do fuel GC plus all that Blackstone does, including list previous test for trend comparison? I've been using Blackstone for a while now, but also now have several GDI engines, two of which are notorious "oil makers". ( EcoBoost and Yamaha F300 outboard )
I have used both and yes, the Polaris report does fuel GC and oil oxidation along with all the other items that BlackStone does. I only do Polaris now for my Turbo GDI engine.
 
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Originally Posted by noclutch
So does the $34 Polaris/Amsoil do fuel GC plus all that Blackstone does, including list previous test for trend comparison? I've been using Blackstone for a while now, but also now have several GDI engines, two of which are notorious "oil makers". ( EcoBoost and Yamaha F300 outboard )
Polaris or any other GC lab for any F300! BS (pun intended) used to tell me only a trace or less than 0.5% fuel for my F300s, when the oil smelled like fuel and actually had 5+% fuel in it. There are ways to address the fuel dilution in F300s, but you really need to know how much is in there. BS isnt capable of that IMHO. Btw, nickel wear seems to track fuel content in my F300s. Have you noticed anything like that in yours? Also, pretty sure I pay less than $30 for each Oil Analyzers/Polaris analysis.
 
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claluga- yea my F300 has always diluted a lot despite "running the [censored] out of it" regularly, but maybe not enough early on. This is my last UOA from about 100hours ago. New one coming soon. [Linked Image]
 
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I emailed Blackstone. $10 extra + a phone call to confirm what you want done to add 40C cSt to the routine standard analysis. Now just have to get a round tuit.
 
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