castrol response(give you guys something to talk about)

[Idrinkmotoroil]

I took their last statement to meanor admit that their formula SLX 0w-30 in Germany is the same as the German Castrol 0w-30 we are now seeing over here, did anyone else get that same interpretation.

Lastly, I've always felt that Patrick Bedard was an idiot, I never knew he wrote this article, but my opinion of him has not changed either way. Why would he state that an oil caused premature engine failure ? , sounds like a stupid unfounded claim like the ones we hear every day. I realize he apologized for it later but I dont like the guy. Just my opinion.

Joey

 

[pscholte]

quote:

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Originally posted by Idrinkmotoroil:
I took their last statement to meanor admit that their formula SLX 0w-30 in Germany is the same as the German Castrol 0w-30 we are now seeing over here, did anyone else get that same interpretation.

Lastly, I've always felt that Patrick Bedard was an idiot, I never knew he wrote this article, but my opinion of him has not changed either way. Why would he state that an oil caused premature engine failure ? , sounds like a stupid unfounded claim like the ones we hear every day. I realize he apologized for it later but I dont like the guy. Just my opinion.

Joey

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"The decision for 0W-30 to be sourced from Germany is based upon the most efficient supply logistics. Both the SLX 0w-30 formula produced in Germany and the Castrol SYNTEC 0w-30 formula produced in North America meet the same performance specifications."

Joey,

My view of the above is that they took care NOT to assert they are the same formula. Look at the highlighted words...Castrol makes a special effort to point to common specs not a common oil; many differently formulated and blended oils can meet the same specs.

Regarding C&D: at one time they were a reliable magazine, a magazine I depended upon for good info. Unless they change their approach, I would NOT depend on them for reliable information any more; last time I checked, and it has been a long time, C&D was as interested in "being cute" or being radical as they were in being a quality car magazine.

[ October 17, 2003, 11:16 PM: Message edited by: pscholte ]

 

[Cary]

My 2 cents:

1) A very carefully drafted letter, that addresses many issues, but at the same time does not answer the questions.

2) Castrol must believe the receiptients of the letter to be stupid. They address the GC, but then claim it is identical to the US 0w-30, ignoring their own labling. I am sure that someone from Castrol has been reading this board, why not address the A1, A3 labling difference?

3) I will continue to avoid the GC for two reasons. 1) I don't believe castrol to be an honest company. 2) I truly believe by the time I use this product, they will chang the formula or pull it from the market.

Cary

 

[JohnBrowning]

1)First thing Castrol has to do is quite lying!!!!

2)Until they quite lying everything they say is suspect!

3)They need to quite playing the BIll CLinton game of symantics and pyscho-babble!

4) They need to make sure that their customer service staff are experts on their product!!

5) They need to change their retail priceing to reflect the quality of the product!!

I laugh at the idea of paying $5 a quart for syntec 5W50 when I get Delvac-1 for the same price of M115W50 for less!! We have not seen syntec hold up in extended drains at all. It always thins out.

While Mobil-1 has a crapy customer service system as well they at least do not tell out right lies!! They also have been busy reformulateing on a preety frequent basis lately. Their product is very consistent and always made out of PAO. They also admitt that they make different formulations for different regions and countrys!

 

[Mystic]

Well now, that sure is a lot of words in that Castrol statement. And few if any of us are really experts in motor oil lubrication, so who knows. It has been my experience in life that if somebody is telling the truth, they don't need a lot of words. Some of the greatest speeches ever made contained few words and were to the point and in simple language.'I have nothing to offer you but blood, sweat, and tears....'

I do have one problem with that Castrol statement. I don't see any way that the German Castrol can be identical to the American Castrol Syntec. Now, based on UOAs, I think that we can say that the German Castrol is a great motor oil. Maybe we don't have enough UOAs, but the ones we have look great so far. I don't know if I have seen any UOAs on American Castrol Syntec or not. But I do recall seeing dust on bottles of American made Syntec in stores.

I have checked the Castrol USA web site and I personally have never found any mention of the German Castrol. If the German Castrol is going to be Castrol's future star, why is it not mentioned at the Castrol web site? I still think there may be a possibility that the German Castrol is just being dumped in this country. Why? I don't know. Maybe it did not sell somewhere else.

But I have a problem if I think somebody may be lying to me. If the German Castrol is not the same as the American Castrol, then don't say that it is. That bothers me. And if there is one statement that may be false, how do we know that other statements are the truth?

So Group III oil thins out quickly, huh? Heck, you don't need expensive Group III oil for that. Apparently, judging from UOAs, Valvoline conventional motor oil thins out nicely. And if Group III oils do thin out quickly, who needs them, anyway?

 

[G-MAN]

quote:

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Originally posted by Mystic:
I have checked the Castrol USA web site and I personally have never found any mention of the German Castrol. If the German Castrol is going to be Castrol's future star, why is it not mentioned at the Castrol web site?

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You need to look again. The 0w30 Syntec is the "German" Syntec. They just don't announce on the web site that it's made in Germany. But if you notice, the 0w30 is the only grade of Syntec that meets the stringent OEM extended drain specs from Mercedes and BMW.

 

[buster]

TS, Al and JB make really good points. TS is right and instead of focusing so much on the base oil, the additive package is what to look for in a good group III. GC is a good alternative to M1. John Browing is right and that while Mobil does have bad customer service, at least they do specify what they make and where it's sold, unlike Castrol. I just can't get excited about one oil (GC) that has so much mystery to it in terms of origin/description etc. Al, I wouldn't be surprised if Mobil is ahead of the curve. They whipped out SS which was "old technology" to Mobil and I'm sure they have a new formula waiting for when the newer oils come out. ExxonMobil's R&D is just too large for them to fall behind. They also know their market, which is primarily street cars. They know it's not necessary for average people driving to work to be using a fully polyester base stock oil, such as RL, with 600ppm of Moly. It's unecessary and doesn't make sense.

 

[nortones2]

Mystic: Churchill actually said as part of a brief, but nevertheless somewhat longer speech than hinted "I say to the House as I said to ministers who have joined this government, I have nothing to offer but blood, toil, tears, and sweat. We have before us an ordeal of the most grievous kind. We have before us many, many months of struggle and suffering." Not unlike Castrol against the unbelievers

 

[userfriendly]

Unless the conumer lubricant business is going to be made up only of 69 cent engine oils...
First you have to convince people that your brand is better than the next and therefore command a higher price.
Then you need to convince people that they need a synthetic lubricant..
That is not hard to do obviously.
Then you have to convince them that only certian types of synthetic engine oils will do.
That gets a little harder obvoiusly.
Then we have people arguing that just because their engine oil is manufactured from one particular group number it is superior to any engine oil manufactured from the other base groups.
That arguement gets a lot of attention because there is little or no proof that a synthetic is needed in the first place, never mind a synthetic manufactured from any particular base group number.
So around and around we go.
Why???
Because the people making those arguements have personal interests in the synthetic PAO success story.
You can be sure of one thing.
Those people do not own stock in any major oil company, and if they do, its the one making and selling the PAOs.
If it were very hard to convince people they needed a synthetic, the rest of the pieces of the puzzle would fall apart.
Especially the arguments the PAO people have with Castrol and other group III refiners.
I think your PAO days are numbered if I may be so bold.
Keep it up. Your death throws are entertaining.

[ October 19, 2003, 08:49 PM: Message edited by: userfriendly ]

 

[GROUCHO MARX]

Come on synthetic users, userfriendly is asking for it!

[ October 20, 2003, 12:37 AM: Message edited by: GROUCHO MARX ]

 

[userfriendly]

Oh thats nuthin'. Rabbits squeal and squeal, just like that fat guy on the movie Deliverance.
Finally I have to put them out of my Misery to use another movie analogy.
Maybe Amadeus Pscholte will write a requiem for Mobil 1 for us, since GDR Castrol is one of the new kids on the block too.

 

[sub_zero]

user friendly,

I think the answer to your question is Canada.

BTW I can get the PC Duron blend and Duron Synthetic for substantially less than what I'd pay for a Litre of Syntec or Mobil 1. Petro-Canada has staked a lot in the GIII play. I believe it's the Chevron technology. I see there lubricants everywhere in oil and gas here in Alberta.

 

[userfriendly]

Sub-0;
Just like Alberta beef.
I'm glad that I posted the above before someone else posted the GTL links in the 2008 group III thread.
Often people wonder why the price of LPG follows the price of CNG. The reason is that several USA power plants have switched from coal fired to natural gas or a combination of the two.
That was done to reduce So2 emmissions and the resulting acid rain caused by burning medium sulphur coal and residual fuels.
The price of natural gas is tied to its energy content. The producers of natural gas found it more profitable not to remove the heavy ends that make up LPG and instead ship or pipe the CNG "wet".
The LPG market tightened up, and the CNG marketers made more money when the demand for natural gas went through the roof.
The price of LPG doubled, and automotive use dropped 10% per year for the last six years.
There is no doubt that GTL plants will put another demand on CNG supply, raising the price of the feed stock again.
Good for Alberta, the other CNG producing regions, and the enviroment, bad for your home heating and electricity budget.
Ralph, if he is so in-Kliened, needs to build some coal fired power plants and use up some of those huge reserves of low sulpher coal that are now only exported to the Pacific rim, and ease the shortage of CNG.
How will the GTL plants help the Alberta economy?
By value-adding to a natural resourse.
How will the GTL plants hurt PAO and group III engine oils?
By producing base stocks that cost half as much as the group IIIs and perform as well as PAOs in 99% of the applications.
How will the GTLs help the enviroment? By offering a cleaner burning diesel and industrial plant fuel.
How will the GTL fuels help the railroads and trucking industry?
By producing cleaner burning fuels that reduce engine wear, and GTL fuels may produce fewer emissions without resorting as much to HP and efficiency robbing engine controls.
Good-bye PAO vs group III arguments, hello GTL base oils.
Coffee?

[ October 23, 2003, 03:57 PM: Message edited by: userfriendly ]

 

[Alex D]

G-man re-read the 5W-40 Syntec specs......it also qualifies for VW, BMW and Mercedes specs, only the BMW LL spec is older (From 98).

quote:

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Originally posted by G-Man II:

quote:

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Originally posted by Mystic:
I have checked the Castrol USA web site and I personally have never found any mention of the German Castrol. If the German Castrol is going to be Castrol's future star, why is it not mentioned at the Castrol web site?

---

You need to look again. The 0w30 Syntec is the "German" Syntec. They just don't announce on the web site that it's made in Germany. But if you notice, the 0w30 is the only grade of Syntec that meets the stringent OEM extended drain specs from Mercedes and BMW.

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[Alex D]

Wadda ya mean with GDR castrol??? GDR used to stand for German Democratic Republic, which was the old East Germany, which is outta biz right now as most people know and surely never manufactured Castrol oil........

quote:

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Originally posted by userfriendly:
Oh thats nuthin'. Rabbits squeal and squeal, just like that fat guy on the movie Deliverance.
Finally I have to put them out of my Misery to use another movie analogy.
Maybe Amadeus Pscholte will write a requiem for Mobil 1 for us, since GDR Castrol is one of the new kids on the block too.

---

 

[userfriendly]

Q: What does demographics, source of supply, or who you choose to like or dislike, have to do with the quality of a product. In this case an engine oil.

 

[GROUCHO MARX]

"Q: What does demographics, source of supply, or who you choose to like or dislike, have to do with the quality of a product. In this case an engine oil. "


A. Everything!

 

[G-MAN]

quote:

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Originally posted by Alex D:
G-man re-read the 5W-40 Syntec specs......it also qualifies for VW, BMW and Mercedes specs, only the BMW LL spec is older (From 98).

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IMO, this oil "doesn't count" because it's not available at retail outlets. It's only avaialble at certain dealers who choose to stock it.