Can U Beleive THIS? MOBIL EP Worst Than Havoline!

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Jan 21, 2009
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Lisgar, Ontario, DoC
As per the chart on the Amsoil's website under 0W-30 product page...it shows that Mobil 1 "Extended Performance" causes most metallic wear scar, even more than regular dino 5W-30 Havoline? http://www.amsoil.com/graphs/sso_4ball_400px.gif http://ww w.amsoil.com/graphs/sso_4ball_400px.gif Surprisingly it does not have Valvoline SynPower nor Castrol Edge listed? I wonder why? Mobil 1 EP is the most advanced oil from Mobil to date, if that is causing so much wear, I wonder what should we make of other regular Mobil 1 and Mobil non-synthetic products? Amsoil can not certainly be lying on ineternational scale from their "the main" website, they will get in big trouble for that, so what should we make out of this? Please comment!
 
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The dreaded 4ball test is one of Amsoils marketing schemes. THey make a great product but it seems that they are reluctant to let the 4 ball test go.
 
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Haven't they come out with more recent test results. Not that I care about 4-ball test results for motor oil anyway.
 

Ibrahim

Thread starter
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Jan 21, 2009
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Is 4-Ball Test fair to judge an oil's performace when it comes to measuring metallic wearing in an engine? can this be used to say, yes Mobil 1 EP will certainly/highly likely to cause more wear than so and so oil because this was the result from the 4-Ball test? can this be said!
 
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According to that test, after one hour of operation Mobil One produced a wear scar greater than 1mm and even AMSOIL produced a wear scar of over .4mm. If that was an accurate indication of how those oils would perform in your engine, don't you think you wouldn't have any engine left after about 1000 hours of operation? Joe
 
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I guess it all depends on how many four-ball-joints, four-ball-bearings and four-ball-roller-rocker-cam-slider-retainers you have in your engine. None of my cars have any of those, so I'm pretty willing to ignore this test. IMO, it's no better or worse than any other oil marketing. It's all pretty worthless. The best marketing is rebates, at least around here.
 
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the 4 ball test has a very small contact patch where oil can lubricate. I can't think of any place in my engine that has that small of a contact patch between metals. The only thing that comes close is the needle bearings in the rocker arms. the problem with the 4 ball is that only one ball rotates; the other 3 are fixed. They should come up with a needle bearing test with a short cycle
 
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In addition to the test itself not being relevant, you have to consider the source. I don't mean to bash AMSOIL at all, they make good products, but why would you listen to their advice about OTHER oils? If you were buying a lawn tractor, would you listen to John Deere's advice about Toro?
 
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 Originally Posted By: Tom NJ
The 4-Ball Wear machine is an excellent tool for developing a lubricant for the 4-Ball Wear machine. Tom NJ
 
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IL
 Originally Posted By: RF Overlord
In addition to the test itself not being relevant, you have to consider the source. I don't mean to bash AMSOIL at all, they make good products, but why would you listen to their advice about OTHER oils? If you were buying a lawn tractor, would you listen to John Deere's advice about Toro?
The "source" is not AMSOIL. Try ASTM. http://www.astm.org/Standards/D4172.htm
 
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seems like the only way you could use this info for a engine is if you had oil pumping out of the area were the metal came in contact such as how and rod bearing and crank do delivering constant oil flow that way the oil film is never sheared or broken allowing metal to metal contact
 
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Engine Oil Performance Testing "I have seen a number of lubricant manufacturers refer to the 4-ball wear scar test as an indicator of how well the oil will protect an engine. Other larger companies tend to brush off the results of this test indicating that it isn't representative of actual engine conditions adding that because it is cheap to run, the results aren't worth much. What are your thoughts on this?" The 4-ball test (ASTM D4172) is often used as a screening test for many different lubricant types that contain antiwear additives or similar base oil properties. Other tribo-mechanical bench tests are often used as well, including the Timken Test (ASTM D2782) and the Pin and V-Block (ASTM D2670). Because engines have different contact geometry, loads, metallurgy and speeds, numerous bench tests and test protocols are needed. It is not uncommon for several oils to be tested using two such methods and to find that the performance rankings between the oils to reverse (no correlation). This is why, among other reasons, Passenger Car Motor Oils and Heavy Duty Oils (diesel crankcase) are tested in actual engines using controlled methods such as ASTM D5533 Sequence IIIE and D5302 Sequence VE. Jim Fitch, Noria Corporation
 
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The 4ball wear test sounds more like a test for Vaseline than motor oil. Obviously people at Amsoil are on top of things. The question is, what are they on top of?
 
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Another useless test that has no real world value to me. I'll continue to not purchase Amsoil. Not that they don't make a good product, but because it's not worth the $$$. 5 quarts for of M1 for 22 bucks right now and M1 EP for 26. I'll stick with that.
 
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One morning, I couldn't sleep, so I watched some guy sell some oil additive. He showed that the various load testers would get better results with bleach than with any engine oil. That is how he refuted the claim that some other guys oil additive was better because of the same load tester.
 
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Amsoil makes some decent products, but their marketing tactics and dealer networks are so scummy I will never use their stuff. Not to mention, its a situation where you can get something as good for orders of magnitude less money. The fanboys present on this site have only reinforced my distaste for Amsoil, among other brands. Seems this site has devolved into a fan boy battle ground, with M1 and Amsoil users making up the front lines.
 
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 Quote:
but their marketing tactics and dealer networks are so scummy I will never use their stuff.
I totally agree. Our customer interface is right down there with the dealer service adviser that tells you 3m/3k and sells you $100/hour service you don't need, the pimple faced kid at a number of auto parts stores, various quick lubes ..and, while a shinning knight of integrity, your Homer old boy racer that hasn't learned a thing about motor oils since the 70's. Our marketing distractions are equal to some crusty highlander smacking people on the arse with a dipstick and making sexual innuendo at the conclusions of our commercial for our high class and totally socialized audience, right up there with bathing cars in sludge ...running engines through a virtual shredder ...and showing golden mustangs emerging from the hood. Some day we'll get some class to match the upstanding level of our audience.
 
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