Calling clinebarger 4l80e new puzzles

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@clinebarger I have been lurking around for years and years and should've joined 10 years ago, I just didn't think it mattered--It certainly does matter.If you have knowledge or can give it to help others, I feel it is a blessed gift. That being said I have a straight to the point matter of a member called Clinebarger.Some of the best transmission reading I have ever done is from him. I have books,Videos and clinebarger seems to know it all.Therefore, I will travel to Texas soon and catch him off guard ,Then perform a Vulcan mind meld for the information required--OR, Simply start with the 1st unanswered never asked or seen on this 4l80e question
What are the acceptable wear measurements on the later 2001 up 4l80e Overrun clutch drum to include the ramp area? Thanks y'all
 

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Vger

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Thank you-My new drum arrives Tuesday and I will measure & post some pictures then. We have no wholesale transmission supplier in Columbia SC so I must mail order everything. I don't remember seeing any write ups on this issue and I believe it is the cause of many no reverse ,intermittent overdrive problems and roller failures.
 

Vger

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Drum came in early and I am even more confused.Turns out the new & old drums measure out about the same.When this transmission was pulled the converter was pulled immediately and the input shaft turned left and right which is wrong. The planet measued out as new so I was sure the smoking gun was the overrun drum.Weird part is I disassembled the drum ,looked fine,put it back together indexing the clutches & planet and it locked??? The snap ring was right--The blue sprag roller were fingers up-I have only read of this once--- SO--I was WRRRROOONN--I can't say it.
 

Vger

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The overdrive sprag was NOT holding when the transmission was on the floor.Pulled overdrive assembly and roller clutch was not locking with planet.Disassembled ,inspected ,reassembled and it locked.Have you ever encountered a new intermittent locking roller clutch?
 

Vger

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BTW--total stock rebuild -No reverse-slipping in D4. Solid D1, 2, 3 .Could not drive as the truck is trapped in shop without reverse.
 

Vger

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Awaiting some ideas, I have read this issue one time before in a thread but rarely do we read the end result. Once a problem is solved everyone fades away or piece's it out on ebay . I can't do that ,I have this 2001-- a 2000 and a- 2005 to do . I will solve it but I sure could use a hand. All is new or rebuilt including the surfaced pump with LB1. Transgo single plate,reamed ACL Trapped checkball assy, measured & assured band pin ,All new quality electronics,And of course every bushing and seal & center support seals left & right of bolt THERE'S NOTHING LEFT IS IT ?
 
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The overdrive sprag was NOT holding when the transmission was on the floor.Pulled overdrive assembly and roller clutch was not locking with planet.Disassembled ,inspected ,reassembled and it locked.Have you ever encountered a new intermittent locking roller clutch?

I have.....The Blue Inserts stick & get Jammed/Cocked from wear to the Sprag Cage. If you would've smacked the O/D Assembly on the bench.....The Inserts & Rollers would've sprung back out.

This is yet another reason I like the earlier O/D Roller Clutch design, Because the springs act directly on the Rollers.

If this comes up again & you can actually drive the vehicle in D3.....Get up to about 20 MPH shift into neutral, Kill the engine & slightly bump the shifter in Park a few times.....The Parking Pawl will rattle the Geartrain enough to release the O/D Rollers if that's the issue.
Don't try to force it all the way into Park.

We used to do this to unstick Governors....Especially on units with hard to access Governors like 200-4R, Ford C6, Chrysler A-727 etc.
 
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Vger

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If this was a used roller I could perhaps entertain the idea.This was a new roller. I will now reinstall with all new roller,drum,planet assy .Thank you
 

Vger

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Another question. What would happen if the blue roller was totally removed and a dual feed direct procedure was performed. Would it have reverse? Would the pin hit the band and try to engage?
 
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Another question. What would happen if the blue roller was totally removed and a dual feed direct procedure was performed. Would it have reverse? Would the pin hit the band and try to engage?

The O/D Roller Clutch HAS to hold for the Forward Drum to be driven which drives the Direct Clutch Hub.
 

Vger

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It is not a Borg Warner part. I haven't ever seen a BW .195 roller assy in my life . BW is probably ashamed to produce them.
Reverse which is my main problem.
Reverse originally applied and you could hear the drum rolling in the band but not holding firm.I have the kent moore pin tool and it specs out for the 2 ribbed pin at 25lbs torque. Pin does measure 3.356 as the ATSG manual shows. Puzzled still
 
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Borg Warner is who designed the .195" roller clutch, You can still get OE part# ‎12431003 which is Borg Warner......I ordered 20 of them not long ago.

I don't use the Kent Moore tool.....I have Late & Early servo covers cut in half with a welded nut.....I crank the band servo tight & make sure it's not bottoming out in the case.

I'm sure you're aware of the late servo pistons cracking every once in a while?
 

Vger

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I thought that was purely an acdelco number. Anyway, I have seen the video of the welded cover ,Too bad ATSG has no proper procedure for this due to the millions of dollars they make off of shops. What do you suggest? The Fitzall pin kit? WIT nor anyone else have selective pins anymore.
Yes the servo was completely checked and has no cracks .
 

Vger

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Another thing I never understood is the band itself .Only the center of the band actually grabs first and the rest is cockeyed.Why has no one engineered a better band? A 4l60 wide styled band would be a better type.
Transgo has a pin check procedure as well as kent moore. So everyone's theory seems to be wrong. Tightening a band to death is not a procedure .I am finding that everyone knows how to make 1000hp work with a 4l80e but no one seems to have a clue how to get 100,00 more miles out of one.
 
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Vger

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Sorry Chris, I can sorta feel that you are tired of giving never ending advice and it sometimes probably feels that people do not listen or read closely enough . I look up to you as a builder but mainly your early years of giving mainstream advice.I do not put you in the arrogant category of Jake's with the berating and troubled answers to questions. My favorite is your 95 suburban 4l80e thread right here on Bob's. A student can feel your passion in teaching back then. I hope others chime in with praise for all the help you have given .
I would have never-ever started the 4l80e without your library of info. Thank You Clinebarger
 
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I don't mean crank it down 'til something bends/breaks. I extend the pin by welding on the end of it. Used to do the same for 700R4/4L60E's before Sonnax came out with a extended pin.

If the Servo Piston is bottoming out.....And the "Welded/Cut Cover" proves that out.....How can the procedure be wrong?

You want the pin as long as possible without the Band dragging on the Reaction Carrier too much....Burning the Band. Seems hit & miss even when using a Borg Warner band straight from the Dealer.
I've even used grooved used/original TH400 bands on smooth 4L80E drums with great result & rarely had to lengthen the Pin.

I've noticed the same with 4L60E's, Using dealer sourced Reverse Input Drum & Band.....The band clearance is a mile & a half. The Drum measures out good.....So it must be the Band??

Giving people trans building advice was rewarding at first....But it became where people were demanding quick & easy "Silver Bullet fixes" no matter what the issue was.
When I frequented the 67-72 Chevy Truck message board.....I'd get 20-50 private messages a day & got burnt out, LS1Tech was no different.
 

Vger

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I can imagine the sorta dread at getting to your messages after work, I do --It is probably a feeling of teaching without a paycheck sorta . Remember-You created Clinebarger and it was a huge success. You should have marketed yourself along with a Paypal page. You still could in reality-Hell, I'd pay for personal time just like ATSG-Look it up!
 
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