Break in oil change schedule

Messages
903
Location
CA
My Honda VTR bike calls for the first oil replacment at 600 miles and then every 7,500 miles. My Honda Civic calls for its' first replacement at 7,500 miles and then every 7,500 miles. Well, I don't follow directions too well so my first oil change was at 250 miles. The next at 1000 miles, then 2500 miles. Looking back I'd say I wasted a bunch of oil and a couple of filters. But why is there such a large difference between the bike and car on the first oil change?
 

Al

Messages
19,163
Location
Elizabethtown, Pa
Did you do these oil changes on the bike or the car??? Anyway I asssume that since you have the wet clutch, gears, and engine on one circuit they need to get that initial shot of oil out of there sooner. Honda cars are interesting-they me be the only manufacturer which uses an actual "break-in" oil-that's why they want it in so long. I let my bike dealer change and put his dino oil in at 600 miles, rode it another 400 and at 1000 miles ("official end of breakin")the dino went away and the Mobil 1 MX4T went in.
 
Messages
3,320
Location
Bolivia
I think we need some engine manufacturer on this board for this one. I got chewed out by the Toyota dealer when I waited til 700 miles for my first oil change on my 99 4Runner. But my 97 Ranger said there was no need to break in the engine, just change at 5,000 miles. Personally I've seen so much junk in oils when I analize them at 100 hours operation that I think it is a good idea to get it out quick.
 

Patman

Staff member
Messages
21,989
Location
Oakville, Ontario
quote:
Originally posted by widman: I think we need some engine manufacturer on this board for this one. I got chewed out by the Toyota dealer when I waited til 700 miles for my first oil change on my 99 4Runner.
Why did he chew you out, when did he expect you to change it? Did he want you to do it sooner or later? I think a 500mi oil change on a new engine is very important, it gets all that assembly lube and other crud out of there. Plus that factory oil usually sucks too.
 
Messages
3,320
Location
Bolivia
I was supposed to change it at 600 miles. If they ever get around to delivering my new pickup I'll see what it is for the 2002 model year.
 
Messages
2,759
Location
CarMax
My Saab required its first change at 1500 miles. I didn't get around to it until almost 2000. The service writer seemed agitated/concerned that the oil had been in there that long. I forgot to ask what exactly was in it that needed changing so badly. At least they did it for free. And get this: Saab provides free oil changes every 10,000 miles. Why 10,000? Because that's the "normal service" change interval. "Severe service" is 5,000 miles. The dealers use Saab-branded 10W-30 synth BLEND, not pure synth. 10,000 miles on a synth blend? Is that a joke? I ain't going no more than 3,000 on that stuff. M1 TriSyn SJ 10W-30 goes right back in. I dunno but there ain't much value in that "free" oil change, IMHO. [ July 27, 2002, 07:42 PM: Message edited by: bretfraz ]
 

Patman

Staff member
Messages
21,989
Location
Oakville, Ontario
quote:
Originally posted by widman: I was supposed to change it at 600 miles. If they ever get around to delivering my new pickup I'll see what it is for the 2002 model year.
He got mad over 100 miles? A friend of mine who is a service advisor for a Chevy dealer up here tells me that about once every couple of months he sees people coming in with completely seized up engines. They have the same problem each time, they bought the car new and never changed the oil at all! He says almost every time the mileage on the car is 70,000km (43,000 miles) GM must've done their homework, because the powertrain warranties on their cars end at 60,000km! This reminds me, our Honda's powertrain warranty ends at 60,000km too, and it's at 59,590km right now. I'm not worried, the car hasn't given us a single problem yet, it's not even been back to the dealer since we bought it in Oct 99!
 

Jay

Messages
1,607
Location
Idaho Falls, ID
The normal service drain interval for the Acura RSX is 10,000 miles also. The severe service interval is half that. I don't have a problem with that, but the manual says to change the filter every other oil change! And they've got this tiny 2 1/4" motorcycle oil filter!
 
Messages
534
Location
South
Satterfi, I think it is better to over oil change than under. My Honda 600 says to do changes every 4K but I am doing 2K since this will probably work out to once a year because of a 3 year old and long job hours. [Frown]
 
Messages
901
Location
Northern Illinois
I left the oil in my new Silverado 4.3 until the change oil light came on at 5708 miles. The oil did not have enough color to detect its level easily until about 3500 miles. During the cycle it used less than half a quart. (didnt get down to the full mark, the factory capacity is 4.5 but they put 5 in and so did the dealer on my first change). My reasoning on this is that years ago in a magazine (I think Mechanics Illustrated) there was an article which demonstrated that engines broke in faster and cooler on used engine oil. I changed again at 9400 to supersyn and it does not seem to show any use in 2K miles. I think I will have it tested when I change again. RW
 
Messages
1,874
Location
Ocala, Florida
quote:
Originally posted by bretfraz: 10,000 miles on a synth blend? Is that a joke? .
Bretfraz, You may be very suprised to know that there is blends out there that can perform as long and longer in some situations against many of the "full synths", So I'd not shy from blends just because of the word blend. That is very mis leading like judgeing a book by its cover. bob
 

Patman

Staff member
Messages
21,989
Location
Oakville, Ontario
Bob is right, don't be scared by a blend. However, he's not talking about the off the shelf blends, as they are not much better than conventional oil, as they only contain a 10% synthetic base (and it's not PAO based either, but group 3) The good blend would be the Schaeffers line of blends, which use a 25% PAO base oil, and a very good additive package which allows the oil to run for longer drains.
 

geo

Messages
62
Location
USA
quote:
Originally posted by Patman: Bob is right, don't be scared by a blend. However, he's not talking about the off the shelf blends, as they are not much better than conventional oil, as they only contain a 10% synthetic base (and it's not PAO based either, but group 3) The good blend would be the Schaeffers line of blends, which use a 25% PAO base oil, and a very good additive package which allows the oil to run for longer drains.
Let's not forget MaxLife... Group II+ oil and 9% Group V esters with 242C flashpoint, 8 TBN and high level of detergents.
 
Messages
1,874
Location
Ocala, Florida
quote:
Originally posted by geo: [QBLet's not forget MaxLife... Group II+ oil and 9% Group V esters with 242C flashpoint, 8 TBN and high level of detergents.[/QB]
I don't think soooo. As for detergents, it does not provide that much. As for extending drains on with maxlife, all I have seen so far indicates it might do 5,000 miles on a good day with a decent engine/driver but is more for those that do standard 3k drains. I would not attempt to do that with this oil. Of course I'm only talking about the sl version of 10w40 that they have out. I'm not sure which you're reffering to.
 

Patman

Staff member
Messages
21,989
Location
Oakville, Ontario
We'll soon see how Maxlife handles slightly extended intervals. I'm planning to go 6000km (3700miles) on my current SL formula Maxlife 10w30. I have used Auto-rx on the prior interval though, so it may help the Maxlife go a bit longer than it normally would. On my last Maxlife interval, of only 2300 miles or so, I already had 40% oxidation. But the viscosity was still very good, and wear metals weren't too bad for a car that's driven pretty hard. (it's a 95 Firebird Formula 350, which I drag race about once a month, and go full throttle about 3-4 times a day, or more)
 

satterfi

Thread starter
Messages
903
Location
CA
Patman 3,700 miles doesn't sound like "Maxlife". Maybe it should be called "Midlife". I don't think that would sell much oil.
 

geo

Messages
62
Location
USA
quote:
Originally posted by Patman: We'll soon see how Maxlife handles slightly extended intervals. I'm planning to go 6000km (3700miles) on my current SL formula Maxlife 10w30. I have used Auto-rx on the prior interval though, so it may help the Maxlife go a bit longer than it normally would. On my last Maxlife interval, of only 2300 miles or so, I already had 40% oxidation. But the viscosity was still very good, and wear metals weren't too bad for a car that's driven pretty hard. (it's a 95 Firebird Formula 350, which I drag race about once a month, and go full throttle about 3-4 times a day, or more)
I would agree that MaxLife is not for extended drain intervals. It's priced between OTS mineral and blend oils, and it should be evaluated with that in mind. It has great numbers on paper(including a TBN that Bob does not believe [Wink] ). I can't wait to see your analysis Pat and then maybe we can figure out how it compares to Pennzoil, Chevron, or Valvoline mineral oils.
 

geo

Messages
62
Location
USA
quote:
Originally posted by Patman: ...I have used Auto-rx on the prior interval though, so it may help the Maxlife go a bit longer than it normally would..
Pat, I don't know if using Auto-Rx prior to MaxLife is a good thing. Some residual Auto-Rx may reduce the viscosity numbers or affect the analysis in some way. Terry may be able to help here. [Confused]
 

geo

Messages
62
Location
USA
quote:
Originally posted by BOBISTHEOILGUY:
quote:
Originally posted by geo: [QBLet's not forget MaxLife... Group II+ oil and 9% Group V esters with 242C flashpoint, 8 TBN and high level of detergents.

I don't think soooo. As for detergents, it does not provide that much. As for extending drains on with maxlife, all I have seen so far indicates it might do 5,000 miles on a good day with a decent engine/driver but is more for those that do standard 3k drains. I would not attempt to do that with this oil. Of course I'm only talking about the sl version of 10w40 that they have out. I'm not sure which you're reffering to.[/QB]
Bob, according to Valvoline, 10W-40/20W-50 SL MaxLife contains more detergents than their conventional oil. I'm sure it does not contain as many detergents as any fleet oil or Schaeffers oil. [Smile] I most likely agree with your comment on its extended drain capability. But, we need to get at least a few oil tests before we make any conclusions. People have various driving styles, engine conditions are different, etc. [ July 29, 2002, 12:31 AM: Message edited by: geo ]
 

Patman

Staff member
Messages
21,989
Location
Oakville, Ontario
quote:
Originally posted by satterfi: Patman 3,700 miles doesn't sound like "Maxlife". Maybe it should be called "Midlife". I don't think that would sell much oil.
I don't think that their Maxlife name refers to how long of an interval it's good for, as they have not been promoting it for longer intervals. They simply think that it's going to extend the life of the engine by reducing wear (which may have been true when they used moly)
 
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