BMW 330CI - Red Line 5w-40 - 5100 miles

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Jul 10, 2004
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1,076
Location
Indiana (IN)
 Code:
Date	5/5/05  10/5/05 3/6/06 6/6/06  3/7/07 6/7/07   3/8/08  9/8/08  10/8/08 6/4/09
Miles	5011	5000	4300	5958	4514	5347	5017	3839	7250	5100
Total	21130	26100	31407	37365	41879	47226	52245	56084	63334	68400
										
Make up	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Oil	BMW	Castrol	Castrol	BMW	Castrol	Castrol	Castrol	Castrol	Red line Red Line
Weight	5w-30	0w-30	0w-30	5w-30	0w-30	0w-30	0w-30	0w-30	5w-40	5w-40
										
Filter	BMW	Mann	BMW	BMW	Mann	Mann	Mann	Mann	Mann	Mann
										
ALUM	4	2	2	2	2	2	4	2	2	4
CHROM	1	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
IRON	9	7	6	4	8	6	11	9	7	7
COPPER	28	22	15	18	22	8	15	9	5	17
LEAD	2	2	2	1	1	1	1	0	0	0
TIN	0	1	0	0	1	1	0	0	0	0
MOLY	124	19	4	104	16	4	3	2	3	149
NICKEL	1	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
MANG	3	1	1	1	1	1	2	1	1	1
SILVER	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
TITAN.	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
POTA	9	1	6	1	2	0	8	3	2	3
BORON	38	9	3	21	4	2	3	2	1	4
SILICON	5	3	3	3	3	2	4	3	4	6
SODIUM	2	4	3	5	3	3	4	2	3	9
CALCIUM	3446	2125	1704	2463	2702	2985	1864	1891	2452	2142
MAGN	18	311	455	83	129	147	448	551	86	30
PHOSP	853	748	781	662	737	782	872	885	988	1032
ZINC	1050	889	964	847	878	1001	1115	1087	1282	1228
BARIUM	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
										
SUS 	65.6	62.5	63.2	64.1	63.8	65.8	64.2	65.5	73.9	78.2
cSt	11.76	10.91	11.11	11.35	11.27	11.82	11.38	11.75	13.97	15.08
Flash	375	375	325	415	360	395	380	400	440	385
Fuel %	<0.5	0.5	3	<0.5	1.3	<0.5	TR	<0.5	<0.5	TR
Antif %	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Water %	0	0	tr	0	0	0	0	0	0	0
Insol %	0.3	0.3	0.2	0.3	0.2	0.2	0.2	0.3	0.3	0.3
TBN	1.8	4	4.7	3.2	2.9	2.6	2.9	4.9	4	1.7
 
Blackstone comments- SCOTT: Copper, from brass or bronze parts increased in the latest sample from your BMW. Copper has been high in the past, yet sporadic, so it could just be an engine bushing wearing a bit more than usual. At 17 ppm, it's not reading that much above averages for the 3.0L, so we'll take a wait and see approach before we call it a problem. All other wear looked great. A trace of gas was found, which isn't a problem. The viscosity was a bit high, and we're not sure why. The TBN was 1.7, quite low compared to the last sample. Due to these, try just 5,500-6,000 miles next. Another Houston Winter UOA, wonder if copper has to do with the winter fuel blend and increased fuel dilution? I am surprised BlackStone flagged the viscosity at 15.08 since they did my VOA and it was 15.15. I must have had a quart or two of the older formula to have Moly at 149. Still running the oil, drove 1060 miles Saturday, will add another 1000+ Friday or Saturday. Will send a sample when I change it then. Should be close to 7500 miles total by then. Will the TBN still be higher, I added about half a quart after this sample to replace what I pulled to bring the level up to full.
 
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Awesome trending on your car! Copper is interesting in that it is bouncing around. Copper went up this time but no other "wear" metals followed suit. Wonder why TBN is lower on this sample. Possibly winter condensation/etc. As a side note I am going to get a virgin "TAN only" test for this oil this week as I forgot to get it when I did my VOA (didn't see it on yours either). Normally one wouldn't get that but I want to see starting TAN on this oil for an experiment. If the TAN is zero, I'll have wasted $10 ha ha. Re moly, was all oil from same case? It would be interesting to see if Moly has any affect on other properties but impossible to tell I suppose unless side-by side comparison of Moly vs. no Moly.
 
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I'm not so sure I'm buying into the Houston "winter" argument. My engine is very similar (a 1998 M52), I've been using GC for a while and M1 0W40 before that and, except for the most recent, my OCIs are about the same as yours. I don't get a UOA every time, and I've only been to Blackstone for some of them, so my whole history isn't in the link below but I do have more than 2 datapoints. My latest thread is here. This last OCI was fairly heavily short-tripped through a CANADIAN winter compared to prior use of the car years ago (pre-house, pre-kids, lots of weekend trips). My copper is maintaining 3ppm with Blackstone, and was low with the other lab as well. I notice that your flashpoints are all over, but Blackstone lumps it all together as "<0.5%" dilution. You may have a fuel dilution issue, but I wouldn't blame it on your temps. Do you idle this car to warm it up? Perhaps you may want to pass the results up the chain to someone like Terry. Find out what components in an M54 can cause copper wear and get more accurate interpretations of your fuel dilution values.
 

shanneba

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Craig, I idle it long enough to fasten my seat belt. I normally drive about 6 miles to work, the long way, and the drive home is about a mile. The winter gas would be the biggest difference in Houston. The summer oil changes are normally after a 1000 mile trip back to Houston, the spring OCI is usually done when not fully warmed up. Saaber1, The last VOA and UOA were all from the same case. This OCI was the 5 quarts left from the case plus 2 oI bought from Turner Motorsports, so it still had the moly looking at the data here.
 
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That TBN is, IMO, too low for redline after only 5000 miles in a not-tough ambient environment, in an N/A engine like this
 
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Magnolia, TX
This engine seems to be trending nicely. The Cu spikes seem to correlate to the amount of fuel in the sump over the life of the OCI. Both oils seem to be holding up well for a 5K OCI, but the last TBN indicates you probably had more fuel dilution than usual over the entire OCI. The Mn indicates that the fuel is always present though. Nice wearing engine. The air filter is working very well, but might not be letting enough air through for optimum combustion.
 

FZ1

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Interesting,thanks for the info. Yeah,the .5 quart will help the tbn a bit but I would keep the oci to 5-6k. If you can afford the car;you can afford a shorter oci.
 
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 Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
It is indicated on this site that with Blackstone TBN method, Redline can be run right to 0. I can find the link if anyone wants it. http://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthre...true#Post242361
Wasn't that pertaining to the old TBN testing method that Blackstone was using back then that was overestimating the TBN value compared to the new testing method that they're using now?
 
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Eh, I wouldn't run RL down to 0. It's really not a super long drain oil. Starting Tbn is only 8.5.
 
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 Originally Posted By: FZ1
Interesting,thanks for the info. Yeah,the .5 quart will help the tbn a bit but I would keep the oci to 5-6k. If you can afford the car;you can afford a shorter oci.
He's already down to ~5000 miles. With a 1 mile commute, IMO he should look at a bus pass, bicycle, or comfortable pair of shoes too. Even relatively short tripping in a Canadian winter my M52 doesn't throw those dilution and copper numbers so there may still be a mechanical problem. Has the OP ever had this checked?
 
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 Originally Posted By: sprintman
Knowing the oil temperature in these engines it's a good oil choice imo.
This is a 330, not a 335. I don't believe there's anything extra-ordinary about the oil temps in this engine (especially after only a mile). Oil temps also aren't responsible for the fuel dilution numbers.
 

shanneba

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No problem affording the shorter OCI, I have 2 cases of Red Line 5w-40 in the trunk now, I have the oil filters being delivered today. I'll change the oil when I get home. The Red Line 5w-40 TBN starts at 10.8 per my Blackstone VOA. I have an oil temp guage, it normally starts at about 80 F in the morning, I get it upto about 170 going to work. It will still be at about 95 when I leave work and get to about 110 by the time I park at home.
 

FZ1

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Thanks for the interesting engine temp info. Wish I had a numeric temp guage in my Honda V6. Good luck.
 
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