Is there any problems and/or benefits by mixing a qt. of synthetic 5W-30 with 4 qts. of regular dino 5W-30 for better winter starting?
or is buying the blended synthetic better in the long run?
Blending synthetic-dino oil?
- Thread starter Roadking
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It won't do any harm, but why not bag the dino idea and just run straight synthetic?
I run Mobil 1 in my wifes Explorer and most of my bikes. My car is going on 10 yrs. old and sits outside. (and it's cold!) So I'm trying to save a few dollars and make it a little easier on the car engine.
I don't know if there's any formula for mixing the oils?
Each brand of oil, and each type of oil within each brand has it's own specific package of additives used to create that oil. (There probably is overlap between types of oil within a brand, and maybe between brands, but we have no way of knowing which have identical add-packs and which are different.) If you mix different additive packages you may end up with a combination that is less effective than either of the originals.
Ask your favorite oil company if they'd recommend mixing. If they just say that the oils are compatible, we already new that; they won't form black cottage cheese inside your engine or anything else yucky when mixed. If they say that it's a good idea, OK.
In any case, most off the shelf syn blends don't have enough synthetic to do much good and aren't worth the money.
Ken
MolaKule
Staff member
Schaeffer's has the Supreme 7000 series blends that is a Group I oil with 17% to 23% PAO synthetics blended in. I'd try those before mixing at home.
I plan to do just that routinely (1 quart synthetic 10W-30) and 3.75 quarts of conventional SuperTech 10W-30) in a new Hyundai Sonata V6 once past the first 3000 mile break-in, though not for the cold starting issue. Here, the summers are often over 100 degress F. daily for five or six weeks, and just shy of 100 degrees F. for much of the rest of the summer season. My reasoning for blending is a little insurance against heat breakdown. A home-brew synthetic blend, if you will. If you buy a commercial synthetic blend, you may not get more than 10% synthetic - and probably a "synthetic" that's really a Group III dino at that. By using the proportion you mentioned, you're getting a 20% concentration and if you use a "real" synthetic such as Mobil 1, you'll get the real deal for probably less out of pocket CA$H than the commercial blend. By the way, I'm neutral in the Group III (hydrogen isomerized "synthetics") vs. Group IV (polymerized PAO "real" synthetics) debate. Also keep in mind that some conventional dino oils (Pennzoil, for instance) use both Group II and Group III base stocks already, though I have no idea at what proportion, and might be worth a look as a total fill.
Roadking,
I'd run Mobil 1, 0w-30 in very cold weather ....You will get significantly better fuel efficiency while the engine is warming up. It can easily take 10 miles before the oil comes to it's max temp. If you run Mobil 1 and change it after 6000-7500 miles, you'll probably save enough in fuel to pay for the difference in a very cold climate ....
TooSlick
Ok, here's a strange question fer ya, frum my Pa:
Back in the '80s it was "understood" that you couldn't mix synthetic and dino oils, ... that it caused breakdown of the viscosity to the point you are running on practically water. They went so far as to say you had to flush the engine of all remnants of dino oil before adding synthetic or else you'll sieze.
So, is this true? Can you just go to an oil-changing place and say "use synthetic" without negative repercussions? Or do you have to have the engine steamed first?
Same thing for the tranny. Can you just switch at the drop of hat?
---------------------------------------------
I'm not shooting you guys down, just trying to learn. Thanks again. ![[Cheers!]](/forums/graemlins/cheers.gif)
quote:Mobil recommends when using the Supersyn for the first time after running a conventional oil to do a regime of 2-3 short change intervals at roughly 2-3k miles because of it's cleaning abilties. They further that " Exxon/Mobil Enginners are wary of conventional oils that tout their use of additional seal-swelling agents. With extended use these agents can over-soften engine seals,resulting in leaks. More to the point,and oil additive will not rejuvenate worn or damaged seals". I tend to believe Mobil on both of the above My personal opinion is there would be no harm in spiking Mobil Drive Clean with a synlube like Amsoil 10/30 or Conoco Syncon 10/30,,maybe even spike the Drive Clean Blend a little. Do it at your own risk though because I will not be held responsible
Originally posted by red2rebel: They went so far as to say you had to flush the engine of all remnants of dino oil before adding synthetic or else you'll sieze.
![[Smile]](images/icons/smile.gif){kind=icon}
Mobil also says it is safe to mix the Supersyn with a dino and that it will only lower the performance of the SS,,,thing is it should also increase the performance of the Dino but I ain't doing it.
[ February 08, 2003, 10:23 AM: Message edited by: dragboat ]
quote:Me too. Good post.
Mobil recommends when using the Supersyn for the first time after running a conventional oil to do a regime of 2-3 short change intervals at roughly 2-3k miles because of it's cleaning abilties. They further that " Exxon/Mobil Enginners are wary of conventional oils that tout their use of additional seal-swelling agents. With extended use these agents can over-soften engine seals,resulting in leaks. More to the point,and oil additive will not rejuvenate worn or damaged seals". I tend to believe Mobil on both of the above
See, M1 will clean well too. ![[Big Grin]](images/icons/grin.gif){kind=icon}
[ February 08, 2003, 10:17 AM: Message edited by: buster ]i always thought the idea of mixing 1 quart was awfully wrong... why not just continue using the mobil 1? use the 0w-30 its great for cold...
Everyone who's into home brewing oils needs to keep something in mind that's been brought out on this forum: the additives used in Group I, Group II, and Group III oils are different and don't work well together. In other words, an additive package tailored for a Group III synthetic is not going to work properly in Group II base oil. If you go mixing a Group II and Group III oil, you'll likely wind up with an oil that is inferior (form a performance standpoint) to either of the two oils you mixed. The same would hold true when mixing Group IV oils with anything else.
If you want to save money, but get some of the cold weather benefits of a PAO oil, you'd be better off getting the Mobil Drive Clean Blend. Other synthetic blends that are nothing but Group II and Group III blends don't really offer any cold weather advantage over most Group II's because a Group III base oil has no pour point advantage over Group II base oil. Both require a pour point depressant. PAO doesn't.
Another option that my neighbour in Canberra used to do was to run an expensive synthetic (AGIP Sint 2000 was about $15 per quart back in 1987) in his volvo with high boost aftermarket turbo.
He'd run 7-8000km in the volvo, drain it, then change the oil on his beater, using the second hand synthetic.
His logic was that the manufacturer believed the oil was good for extended drains, but he'd rather not risk his pride and joy.
The extended drain part came in the get to work car. Never had a problem, and was very very careful to avoid contamination.
quote:I would say you would not see any benifit from 1 qt. If you want better cold weather starts, you need to use a 5W-30 or 0W-30 oils, either synthetic (better) or pertoleum. Back in the old days (70's) we would add a quart of synthetic oil to petroleum oil to help clean the engine (synthetic are high detergent) crankcase before switching over to complete synthetic. But the are crankcase cleaners now that make this not worth it. [ February 08, 2003, 12:30 PM: Message edited by: Mike ]
Originally posted by Roadking: Is there any problems and/or benefits by mixing a qt. of synthetic 5W-30 with 4 qts. of regular dino 5W-30 for better winter starting? or is buying the blended synthetic better in the long run?
Patman
Staff member
That's not a bad idea! (using the oil in a beater car since it's not worn out yet)
I told that to a guy on another message board, who refuses to let his Mobil 1 stay in his Trans Am for more than 1000 miles!! Such a waste of good oil if he doesn't put it in another car afterwards. ![[No no]](/forums/graemlins/nono.gif)
I am not sure that I got an answer to my following post:
quote:*** I've read conflicting posts regarding this issue, mostly pertaining to whether they were high mileage vehicles or not. Thanks Again !!!!!
Originally posted by red2rebel (with some modifications): Again, From my Pa, Back in the '80s it was "understood" that you couldn't mix synthetic and dino oils, ... that it caused breakdown of the viscosity to the point you are running on practically water. They went so far as to say you had to flush the engine of all remnants of dino oil before adding synthetic or else you'll sieze. **** Was this FACT or FICTION or MYTH ???**** Can you just go to an oil change facility and say "change to synthetic" without negative repercussions? Or do you have to have the engine steamed / flushed first? Same thing for the tranny. Can you just switch at the drop of hat?
Fiction as far as Amsoil. I don't know where you heard that info but its news to me. There were/are a lot of false rumors abound about synthetic lubricants. But this is the years 2003 and oil have come a long way since the 80's.
Just as you can't or should not mix some medictions, I would od the same with oils. The risks far outweight the advantages.
I know AMSOIL synthetic motor oils are fully compatible with conventional motor oils. I have no information about others but I can tell you this, it would be foolish to add a petro oil to a synthetic.
I would trust what the manf. says before I would rely on web mesage board hearsay.
[ February 09, 2003, 08:53 AM: Message edited by: Mike ]
Serious problems from mixing dino oil and syn oil?...total fiction.
All API spec engine oils (even non-certified oils) are fully compatible. Mixing them will not cause engine damage. You might not have the full protection that you get from using one oil or the other due to different additive packages not working together, but no damage. And the oil won't turn water-thin.
Ken
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