I did post the specs on the report.The out of line numbers.Aluminum is marked high at 84 and average is 20,copper at 206 average is 51,lead was 370 and average is 39,tin at 11 and average is 4. Does show ZINC at 127 and average is 165. Amsoil tech line says that they have NOT had any issues with Chrysler autos and their fliud.If there was a issue they would issue a TSB or find out what and why.That the Amsoil ATF exceeds ATF+4 specs and wondered how much the COOLER contributed to the numbers.Fliud stayed RED for ages and ages.Blackstone said fliud is NOT burnt and that acids were way in line.
Blackstone Lab report.NOT HAPPY!
- Thread starter hounddog
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Originally Posted By: kingrob
To anybody that watches King of Queens, can't you imagine Jerry Stiller (Carrie's dad) shouting the title of this thread while pounding a stack of papers?
Actually, I see Jerry Stiller shouting this as George's father on "Seinfeld" during the airing of grievances during Festivus.
To anybody that watches King of Queens, can't you imagine Jerry Stiller (Carrie's dad) shouting the title of this thread while pounding a stack of papers?
Actually, I see Jerry Stiller shouting this as George's father on "Seinfeld" during the airing of grievances during Festivus.
Originally Posted By: Johnny
I have seen ATF go from red, to pink, to brunt brown, but I have never seen it turn grape purple. Has anything else been added to this trans? Does the fluid smell burnt?
my ATF (T-iv) had a purplish tinge when drained at 45k...
I have seen ATF go from red, to pink, to brunt brown, but I have never seen it turn grape purple. Has anything else been added to this trans? Does the fluid smell burnt?
my ATF (T-iv) had a purplish tinge when drained at 45k...
Originally Posted By: Toy4x4runner
4runners experience: bought it with 48k from yota dealer. Original fluid looked great but wanted to change it as prev maint at 60k. Changed fluid out for Amsoil and cleaned OEM trans screen per Factory Service Manual. I've done a few of these. Ran great to about 80k. Trans started to pop and was on it's way out. Sold vehicle shortly after this started.
RX300: changed the fluid & filter out for the first time ever at 80k. Car now has 135k. No problems thus far. But it does shift slightly different than before and other RX's I've driven. Plan on changing it out at 140k to OE spec ToyotaIV? fluid from Valvoline or something.
the only thing that makes me nervous about the Amsoil ATF is how it meets every spec in the book. It's the one size fits all. From what I gather different types of fluids have different properties for reasons. Dexron III, or VI won't work where ford SP is spec'd. who knows.
Sounds like your recommending against amsoil ATF. I've stuck with T-IV in my vibe. shifting has stayed the same since new.
4runners experience: bought it with 48k from yota dealer. Original fluid looked great but wanted to change it as prev maint at 60k. Changed fluid out for Amsoil and cleaned OEM trans screen per Factory Service Manual. I've done a few of these. Ran great to about 80k. Trans started to pop and was on it's way out. Sold vehicle shortly after this started.
RX300: changed the fluid & filter out for the first time ever at 80k. Car now has 135k. No problems thus far. But it does shift slightly different than before and other RX's I've driven. Plan on changing it out at 140k to OE spec ToyotaIV? fluid from Valvoline or something.
the only thing that makes me nervous about the Amsoil ATF is how it meets every spec in the book. It's the one size fits all. From what I gather different types of fluids have different properties for reasons. Dexron III, or VI won't work where ford SP is spec'd. who knows.
Sounds like your recommending against amsoil ATF. I've stuck with T-IV in my vibe. shifting has stayed the same since new.
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Blackstone's "average" is pretty meaningless in these situations.
Once again I agree with you Pablo. What particularly concerns me about the averages is that since the various additive packages used in ATFs are in many cases quite different in their makeup I cannot see how an average in the additive area of the analysis can have any meaning at all.
Blackstone's "average" is pretty meaningless in these situations.
Once again I agree with you Pablo. What particularly concerns me about the averages is that since the various additive packages used in ATFs are in many cases quite different in their makeup I cannot see how an average in the additive area of the analysis can have any meaning at all.
A engineer with Amsoil called and e/mailed me today.He said the Amsoil ATF does/did change color and that the Blackstone lab results were not abnormal.That 'THEY'see a lot HIGHER numbers then mine and that the 'LOW"numbers that Blackstone says is universal averages are unrealilictly low.
Originally Posted By: hounddog
A engineer with Amsoil called and e/mailed me today.He said the Amsoil ATF does/did change color and that the Blackstone lab results were not abnormal.That 'THEY'see a lot HIGHER numbers then mine and that the 'LOW"numbers that Blackstone says is universal averages are unrealilictly low.
Did you read the Amsoil people all the numbers? Did they question the Zinc? Its not in Amsoil ATF. When I had a poor UOA a year or so ago I emailed it to Amsoil and they said the ATF was not Amsoil given the Zinc, that something must have happened during the flush. I have since concluded it was redidual Zinc since its now coming down in each UOA and I have been using only Amsoil ATF for maybe 50K - 60K. Vehicle has 206K.
A engineer with Amsoil called and e/mailed me today.He said the Amsoil ATF does/did change color and that the Blackstone lab results were not abnormal.That 'THEY'see a lot HIGHER numbers then mine and that the 'LOW"numbers that Blackstone says is universal averages are unrealilictly low.
Did you read the Amsoil people all the numbers? Did they question the Zinc? Its not in Amsoil ATF. When I had a poor UOA a year or so ago I emailed it to Amsoil and they said the ATF was not Amsoil given the Zinc, that something must have happened during the flush. I have since concluded it was redidual Zinc since its now coming down in each UOA and I have been using only Amsoil ATF for maybe 50K - 60K. Vehicle has 206K.
Originally Posted By: hounddog
I have a 1998 Dodge 1500 v8 automatic.It has 94k on it now.At 40k I did a fluid exchange with AMSOIL ATF and added a trans cooler.At 60k did a filter change and top off with AMSOIL ATF.Now at 94k the fluid was a grape purple.I sent a sample to BLACKSTONE LABS.REPORT SAYS "Wear read high.Copper,lead and tin from clutch plates are most out of line.Aluminum(torque converter)is also high.Not all ATF's are compatible with all transmissions.Suggest switching over to whatever Dodge recommends and flushing the system.Check back in 20k. The switching over to Chrysler ATF+4 is a surprise.Blackstone surely knows its ATF+4 but doesn't 'SAY" it.They have had to have seen this before I would think. I thought I was USING a superior fliud using Amsoil full synthetic ATF.I'm VERY disappointed.Any thoughts on this?
My first thought is: How is the trans performing? I have had 2 mini vans and 3 durangos and none had stellar transmissions. The FWD transmissions made by chrysler are very poor.
I have a 1998 Dodge 1500 v8 automatic.It has 94k on it now.At 40k I did a fluid exchange with AMSOIL ATF and added a trans cooler.At 60k did a filter change and top off with AMSOIL ATF.Now at 94k the fluid was a grape purple.I sent a sample to BLACKSTONE LABS.REPORT SAYS "Wear read high.Copper,lead and tin from clutch plates are most out of line.Aluminum(torque converter)is also high.Not all ATF's are compatible with all transmissions.Suggest switching over to whatever Dodge recommends and flushing the system.Check back in 20k. The switching over to Chrysler ATF+4 is a surprise.Blackstone surely knows its ATF+4 but doesn't 'SAY" it.They have had to have seen this before I would think. I thought I was USING a superior fliud using Amsoil full synthetic ATF.I'm VERY disappointed.Any thoughts on this?
My first thought is: How is the trans performing? I have had 2 mini vans and 3 durangos and none had stellar transmissions. The FWD transmissions made by chrysler are very poor.
I forwarded the lab results to Amsoil.He had the same sheet in front of him as I did.Trans works correctly and shifts same as it has since new.Did not ask about the Zinc per se.Bans in the trans have never been adjusted but I stood with the tech while he checked the play in the levers and nothing out of the ordinary.I going to run the ATF+4 about 5k and if I don't sell the truck its due for a big service at 100k I'll hook it to a BG machine and exchange in the Amsoil again.I just can't buy that the ATF+4 can or will outperform a true Group 4 full synthetic.Biggest thing the Amsoil engineer said was the difference in the old Mopar fliud and the Atf+4 was the ATF+4 was a slicker fliud to stop torque converter shudder.The Amsoil does reduce heat and holds up to heat better then the Chrysler stuff as well as flowing cold better.It IS a Group 4 full synthetic.
If someone is using the BG flush machine for you, ask them to not use the BG chemical flush or to add the BG conditioner to the new fluid. All the transmission needs is the ATF in it.
I have a Jeep Wrangler and took it to my local Jeep dealer that happens to feature Valvoline products. I had them do a ATF flush on my transmission and they added the chemical to the flush and the conditioner to the new ATF. It shifted like c r a p. I took it back to them with my transmission fluid (Amsoil ATF) and said flush it again and leave all of the chemicals out. Shifts better than new now.
I have a Jeep Wrangler and took it to my local Jeep dealer that happens to feature Valvoline products. I had them do a ATF flush on my transmission and they added the chemical to the flush and the conditioner to the new ATF. It shifted like c r a p. I took it back to them with my transmission fluid (Amsoil ATF) and said flush it again and leave all of the chemicals out. Shifts better than new now.
Originally Posted By: Johnny
If someone is using the BG flush machine for you, ask them to not use the BG chemical flush or to add the BG conditioner to the new fluid. All the transmission needs is the ATF in it.
I have a Jeep Wrangler and took it to my local Jeep dealer that happens to feature Valvoline products. I had them do a ATF flush on my transmission and they added the chemical to the flush and the conditioner to the new ATF. It shifted like c r a p. I took it back to them with my transmission fluid (Amsoil ATF) and said flush it again and leave all of the chemicals out. Shifts better than new now.
The problem with flush machine chemicals is that they are basically 'contaminants'. The original formulations were developed precisely as a balanced additive package to deliver the required performance for the application. Therefore, if you need to flush, you should do it with the recommended product. Otherwise just do a straight change.
If someone is using the BG flush machine for you, ask them to not use the BG chemical flush or to add the BG conditioner to the new fluid. All the transmission needs is the ATF in it.
I have a Jeep Wrangler and took it to my local Jeep dealer that happens to feature Valvoline products. I had them do a ATF flush on my transmission and they added the chemical to the flush and the conditioner to the new ATF. It shifted like c r a p. I took it back to them with my transmission fluid (Amsoil ATF) and said flush it again and leave all of the chemicals out. Shifts better than new now.
The problem with flush machine chemicals is that they are basically 'contaminants'. The original formulations were developed precisely as a balanced additive package to deliver the required performance for the application. Therefore, if you need to flush, you should do it with the recommended product. Otherwise just do a straight change.
I had to get the transmission rebuilt in my Dodge pick up, since then I've used Redline ATF C+ which was made for Chrysler transmissions and ATF+4 fluid since I used up the last of the Redline. Before the rebuild, used a non-syn universal fluid (Amoco IIRC).
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