Audi Says Goodbye to IC Engines

Are you serious? Could you imagine a large publically traded company announcing, "We're going to open a new plant. Can't tell ya when but gosh darn it we're going to do it."
Opening a plant is nowhere near the same as saying there will be no more IC vehicles on such and such date. Opening a plant can be predicted. Ending the production of IC vehicles can't...there are just way too many variables when talking about going all EV...
 
Opening a plant is nowhere near the same as saying there will be no more IC vehicles on such and such date. Opening a plant can be predicted. Ending the production of IC vehicles can't...there are just way too many variables when talking about going all EV...
Well, moving off ICE is a huge undertaking. It is not an overnight drivetrain swap. They have to start sooner rather than later.
Smart companies like Porsche Audi know they have a lot of catching up to do.
 
What about households with four drivers? Where will they park for recharging? How many cars can be charged at once?
California’s “Ban” on “internal combustion engines “ is actually not much of a ban at all.

Per the rules California requires the car to “plug in” but it does not actually ban engines.

So in other words Plug In Hybrids (PHEV) meets the 2030 requirements, you will also find a bunch of exempted classes, etc
And of coarse can always drive your antique ICE.
 
Opening a plant is nowhere near the same as saying there will be no more IC vehicles on such and such date. Opening a plant can be predicted. Ending the production of IC vehicles can't...there are just way too many variables when talking about going all EV...

My point is that when companies make an important announcement there's always a date attached to it. Stop being a curmudgeon. You sound like all those old timers back in the 1980's who were angry that cars came with fuel injection and PCV systems rather an the "good old 4-barrel"
 
My point is that when companies make an important announcement there's always a date attached to it. Stop being a curmudgeon. You sound like all those old timers back in the 1980's who were angry that cars came with fuel injection and PCV systems rather an the "good old 4-barrel"
Actually FI was a very good thing especially EFI those are GOOD tech advancements which greatly helped reliability, of course when it breaks it is much more expensive to diagnose and repair so that is a negative. PCV is OK tech as long as the system is designed properly and you replace the valve when required due to wear.

Fact is that EV are going to be far more expensive to produce, create more pollution in production, more difficult to repair and more dangerous to work on, and of course far more expensive to buy, and they get little range and take hours to charge.
 
Actually FI was a very good thing especially EFI those are GOOD tech advancements which greatly helped reliability, of course when it breaks it is much more expensive to diagnose and repair so that is a negative. PCV is OK tech as long as the system is designed properly and you replace the valve when required due to wear.

Fact is that EV are going to be far more expensive to produce, create more pollution in production, more difficult to repair and more dangerous to work on, and of course far more expensive to buy, and they get little range and take hours to charge.
More expensive to produce? Initially yes, but that changes via economies of scale.


Create more pollution in production? Well ya, but lifecycle pollution will be net lower and that's the entire point. Not to mention that the batteries themselves can be repurposed (in the short term).

More difficult to repair? Electric motors aren't anything new or special. Besides there's less to actually repair because the BEV contain less parts overall. The parts which could require repairing are the same found on an ICE. It's still a vehicle after all.

More dangerous to work one? Perhaps, but then again it's not like those dangerous components need a lot of attention anyways.

Range? Well they get plenty of range for the typical user (commuter, grocery getter) and it getting better. Of course there are outliers but there will always be hybrids to serve rural markets.

The big negative is that it's going to put a squeeze on buyers who want the cheapest, oldest, vehicle they can get while reducing costs even further buy wrenching on it themselves. However this hurdle has always been there, it just might be a little taller this time around.

Another thing is the price of fuel. It will go up.
 
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The EV trend is kind of alarming, and I don't like that it is being shoved down our throats so quickly. I can get on board with a hybrid, no problem. But pure EV is a stretch. More and more EVs are showing up out here in the 'burbs, yet there are virtually no public charging stations around here. Most of these owners are charging up at home. I suppose the day will quickly come where most houses will have cars in the driveway with cords running from them. Not ready for that.

ICE cars won't just suddenly go away, unless they are flat-out outlawed which will never happen. However as EV takes hold, and demand for gas goes down, gas prices might increase to the point where people are forced to get an EV due to cost. Plus, if EVs became that common place, and ICE cars fall out of favor and demand, the value of ICE vehicles will plummet.

It is surprising that the automakers are so quick to sell vehicles that require very little maintenance. The service department is a huge revenue source for dealers, yet they want to embrace selling vehicles that do not need routine maintenance such as oil changes, fluid changes, etc. Maybe that is their goal...eventually go to a service model where the techs only do brake work and tires, and everything else is fixable with a software update?
After checking what Tesla has done, I'm afraid everything will be tightly integrated like an iPhone and when it fails, you have to buy an expensive new one instead of fixing it. Check Rich Rebuild on Youtube to see how hard it is to fight with car manufacture in order to repair by owner or third parties. Also consider how much power manufactures will have on smart vehicle. Tesla can stop a vehicle's supercharge capability by OTA and literally stranded owner on the road.
 
After checking what Tesla has done, I'm afraid everything will be tightly integrated like an iPhone and when it fails, you have to buy an expensive new one instead of fixing it. Check Rich Rebuild on Youtube to see how hard it is to fight with car manufacture in order to repair by owner or third parties. Also consider how much power manufactures will have on smart vehicle. Tesla can stop a vehicle's supercharge capability by OTA and literally stranded owner on the road.
I don’t think Rich Rebuild is the best example. He is totally unsafe in the way he works and will likely get himself if not other‘s killed. I’m a qualified high voltage battery repair tech up to 1000 volts. If I was a manufacturer I would not want to be associated with him in any way.
 
I don’t think Rich Rebuild is the best example. He is totally unsafe in the way he works and will likely get himself if not other‘s killed. I’m a qualified high voltage battery repair tech up to 1000 volts. If I was a manufacturer I would not want to be associated with him in any way.
Must be a European thing…

Yeah it’s not as hard as you think to work with a Killovolt, not saying Rich is safe or not just that fixing a car electric or not is not complicated and everyone has right to repair
 
except most of this isn't true now, and none of it will be true in the future...
It's true, and appears to be for some time until the battery technology and motor technology makes serious advances to reduce requirement for rare metals especially along with the other issues as well.
 
My point is that when companies make an important announcement there's always a date attached to it. Stop being a curmudgeon. You sound like all those old timers back in the 1980's who were angry that cars came with fuel injection and PCV systems rather an the "good old 4-barrel"
But this is the equivalent of giving someone the date they will die...it can't possibly be known...
 
I’m still a believer in what Jonny Lieberman from Motor Trend says about EV profitability. And that is, not too far down the road, EVs will be cheaper to make than ICE cars, which is a primary reason manufacturers want to switch to EVs. They’ll make more money.

Ever seen a tear-down video of an EV power train (motor and gear set)? Amazingly simple and cheap to make.

With EV battery production in the early stages of massive growth, battery prices will drop significantly.
 
Must be a European thing…

Yeah it’s not as hard as you think to work with a Killovolt, not saying Rich is safe or not just that fixing a car electric or not is not complicated and everyone has right to repair
If working safely is a European thing then I will accept that. I would rather be safe at work than dead.

No it’s not hard you just need the right mind set, training, tooling and PPE. Once a system is classified as voltage free outside of the battery unit it is quite simple to replace a motor or power electronics.

I’m keeping my ICE for now though.
 
I’m still a believer in what Jonny Lieberman from Motor Trend says about EV profitability. And that is, not too far down the road, EVs will be cheaper to make than ICE cars, which is a primary reason manufacturers want to switch to EVs. They’ll make more money.

Ever seen a tear-down video of an EV power train (motor and gear set)? Amazingly simple and cheap to make.

With EV battery production in the early stages of massive growth, battery prices will drop significantly.
100%
 
I’m still a believer in what Jonny Lieberman from Motor Trend says about EV profitability. And that is, not too far down the road, EVs will be cheaper to make than ICE cars, which is a primary reason manufacturers want to switch to EVs. They’ll make more money.

Ever seen a tear-down video of an EV power train (motor and gear set)? Amazingly simple and cheap to make.

With EV battery production in the early stages of massive growth, battery prices will drop significantly.
I equate this changeover to the one with R/C planes from nitro power to battery powered. The changeover didn't happen overnight, and the hurdles were many of the same presented to Automakers now. Now flying R/Cs I only fly electric. Electric has too many advantages to mention (now), there's simply no reason to fly nitro anymore. I suspect the same will happen with the automotive world, but just as with R/C planes, no dates could accurately be predicted or announced...people still fly nitro powered planes, but electrics are much more prevalent these days...
 
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