Are VW and Mazda on the upswing?

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by KrisZ
Originally Posted by edyvw

A. You do know DSG is not automatic.
B. there is no such thing as lifetime fluid.

If the transmission shifts gears automatically it is an automatic transmission. There are different types of auto transmissions of course.

DSG is robotic manual transmission! There is HUGE engineering difference between your torque converter automatic and DSG, hence different maintenance requirements.

 

[StevieC]

Originally Posted by PimTac
I'm guessing that VW Fanboy Island, wherever that is, has no traffic to speak of. For many drivers who live in areas where traffic is horrendous, owning a manual transmission vehicle becomes a pain in the bum. An automatic is preferred and frankly, having driven both over my driving lifetime I prefer the automatic.

Slogging through 30 miles of stop and go gets tiring, not just on me but the clutch as well. Do that on a regular basis and anyone would switch. Nothing against manual shift, but it's a personal preference.

Agreed. If I didn't spend my days on the road for work or live in a heavily congested area I would buy a stick because they are a lot of fun to drive over today's usually over aggressive or boring automatic transmissions. However I don't want to end up shifting back/forth or playing the engine braking / accelerating game rocking back and forth in traffic.

 

[pezzy669]

I had a 2010 Mazda 3 GT w/6 spd manual. Of all my cars that one provided me the most satisfaction despite not having the feel or heft the Germans provide.

~85k miles and the only repair it ever needed (while under warranty) was the HVAC recirculate actuator. It's was super reliable and never gave me any issues.

Service was super cheap as this was one model year year before they started recommending synthetic oil, service departments were very good and the car was an absolute hoot to drive. Only bad was the MZR 2.5 was pretty archaic at the time and got pretty horrific fuel economy for a big 4 banger in a compact car, IIRC it was rated 28 or 29 hwy.

Had a 2014 or 2014 (first year of current gen) GT with the Sky 2.5 for a hot minute and it felt just as great as my ‘10. It did have some first year teething issues (infotainment screen display would bounce around while cold and the heads up display screen would sometimes not deploy or would randomly raise and lower while driving).

I would not hesitate to get another Mazda, VW I would be a little more hesitant.

 

[maxdustington]

Originally Posted by PimTac
I'm guessing that VW Fanboy Island, wherever that is, has no traffic to speak of. For many drivers who live in areas where traffic is horrendous, owning a manual transmission vehicle becomes a pain in the bum. An automatic is preferred and frankly, having driven both over my driving lifetime I prefer the automatic.

Slogging through 30 miles of stop and go gets tiring, not just on me but the clutch as well. Do that on a regular basis and anyone would switch. Nothing against manual shift, but it's a personal preference.
VW Fanboy Island = Toronto, Ontario. I live in a borough that borders on metro Toronto so I don't need to be told what driving stick in city or highway traffic is like. My old car was a stick and I much preferred it, and I drove across the city through the city or on the highway all the time. Traffic would be considered horrendous here.

Nice attempt at gatekeeping though, however there are posters here below age 50 who still enjoy manual transmissions.

 

[PimTac]

Originally Posted by maxdustington
Originally Posted by PimTac
I'm guessing that VW Fanboy Island, wherever that is, has no traffic to speak of. For many drivers who live in areas where traffic is horrendous, owning a manual transmission vehicle becomes a pain in the bum. An automatic is preferred and frankly, having driven both over my driving lifetime I prefer the automatic.

Slogging through 30 miles of stop and go gets tiring, not just on me but the clutch as well. Do that on a regular basis and anyone would switch. Nothing against manual shift, but it's a personal preference.
VW Fanboy Island = Toronto, Ontario. I live in a borough that borders on metro Toronto so I don't need to be told what driving stick in city or highway traffic is like. My old car was a stick and I much preferred it, and I drove across the city through the city or on the highway all the time. Traffic would be considered horrendous here.

Nice attempt at gatekeeping though, however there are posters here below age 50 who still enjoy manual transmissions.





Well good for you

pads

 

[Dave9]

Originally Posted by maxdustington
Nice attempt at gatekeeping though, however there are posters here below age 50 who still enjoy manual transmissions.


There are many different ways to be masochistic. Manual transmission in a modern car, for use on public roads is one of them. Most people learn that decades before age 50.

I can see it though, on a cheap little car with an anemic engine. It makes it seem like the car is more powerful than it is, and may really gain a few %.

 

[Rmay635703]

Unless it's electrically motivated
I would never own an automatic again.

EPA is easy to beat in a manual but impossible to meet in an auto

Maintenance is cheaper and the box is more reliable

I honestly can't think of any positive aspect of an auto

Heck in traffic on the rare occasion that happens
I usually coast along engine off, lite it up once it's time to accelerate,
on a slight downward slope I coasted a couple miles engine off slinking slowly in traffic, simply can't do that in an autotragic
I was over 85 mpg on a tank of gas once because of that

 

[Vern_in_IL]

VW.... I really don't care, like Soccer, might be above a GM product, that is not saying much. I'm one that thinks diesel is for work machinery, tractor trailers, hd trucks, gasoline is for family cars. This is not the EU, so keep your socialist ideals over there.
Mazda I really like their designs, the styling dept is spot on, better than Chrysler's designs. The Miata is a winner, just wished their dealer network was better!

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted by Rmay635703
Unless it's electrically motivated
I would never own an automatic again.

EPA is easy to beat in a manual but impossible to meet in an auto

Maintenance is cheaper and the box is more reliable

Have you priced out the cost of a clutch job on a late-model car that uses a dual-mass flywheel?

From a cost of ownership standpoint, I would rather take my chances on an automatic...

 

[StevieC]

Clutches shouldn't need to be replaced if the driver it operating the vehicle properly.

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted by StevieC
Clutches shouldn't need to be replaced if the driver it operating the vehicle properly.

I guess it depends on what you are driving - if the car is even slightly performance oriented, there is a good chance that you will be replacing it at some point.

Like magic, most of the G35/G37 clutches we've done were on cars between 100K-130K. List price on the parts alone are about $2K and the dealer is usually quoting in the $3K-$4K neighborhood for a clutch job.

 

[wag123]

VW products really haven't improved much. When they are new they have a quality look and feel with excellent driving dynamics and they have always been pretty good vehicles for the first 5 years or 60k miles, then they go down-hill fast when they get older. VW products have been like that forever. Buyers are aware of this fact, that is why they lengthened their warranty. 20 year old 200k mile VWs are rare and always have been, they tend to be "retired" when they get 140 to 150k miles or so on them because they turn into money pits that are not economically repairable. Getting into bed with Ford isn't going to help either one of them IMO.
Mazda's products have improved noticeably since they got in bed with Toyota, just like Subaru's products did over a decade ago.

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted by Rmay635703
I honestly can't think of any positive aspect of an auto

You obviously don't live in a large metro area with nearly 24/7 "rush hour" traffic and 20,000 poorly timed stop lights. NO WAY would I buy a manual transmission vehicle to use as a daily driver where I live. Personally, given the kind of traffic that I'm mired in on a daily basis, the overriding positive aspect of an automatic is... sanity!

 

[CR94]

Originally Posted by wag123
... 20 year old 200k mile VWs are rare and always have been, they tend to be "retired" when they get 140 to 150k miles or so on them because they turn into money pits that are not economically repairable. ...
My brother's Jetta was running well when retired at about (estimated because the odometer didn't work) 340k miles, because seemingly nobody could fix its wretched shift linkage.

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted by CR94
Originally Posted by wag123
... 20 year old 200k mile VWs are rare and always have been, they tend to be "retired" when they get 140 to 150k miles or so on them because they turn into money pits that are not economically repairable. ...
My brother's Jetta was running well when retired at about (estimated because the odometer didn't work) 340k miles, because seemingly nobody could fix its wretched shift linkage.

I never said that they are ALL retired by 150k miles. There are exceptions, and your brother is one of them. I reiterate, high mile VWs tend to be rare.
http://dashboard-light.com/vehicles/Volkswagen_Jetta.html
By looking at the ratings, one could come to the conclusion that they have gotten a LOT better in recent years, but, like I mentioned above, NOT SO. It is just that in recent years, they are newer, and they are less problematic when they are newer.

 

[javacontour]

I view this in another way. There are many people older than 50 who still enjoy manual transmissions. But there are many more who have simply given up on life and want to be passengers behind the wheel.

Originally Posted by Dave9
Originally Posted by maxdustington
Nice attempt at gatekeeping though, however there are posters here below age 50 who still enjoy manual transmissions.


There are many different ways to be masochistic. Manual transmission in a modern car, for use on public roads is one of them. Most people learn that decades before age 50.

I can see it though, on a cheap little car with an anemic engine. It makes it seem like the car is more powerful than it is, and may really gain a few %.

 

[KrisZ]

Originally Posted by wag123
Originally Posted by CR94
Originally Posted by wag123
... 20 year old 200k mile VWs are rare and always have been, they tend to be "retired" when they get 140 to 150k miles or so on them because they turn into money pits that are not economically repairable. ...
My brother's Jetta was running well when retired at about (estimated because the odometer didn't work) 340k miles, because seemingly nobody could fix its wretched shift linkage.

I never said that they are ALL retired by 150k miles. There are exceptions, and your brother is one of them. I reiterate, high mile VWs tend to be rare.
http://dashboard-light.com/vehicles/Volkswagen_Jetta.html
By looking at the ratings, one could come to the conclusion that they have gotten a LOT better in recent years, but, like I mentioned above, NOT SO. It is just that in recent years, they are newer, and they are less problematic when they are newer.


Here is Craigslist search in the Bay Are for VW with 200k miles or more selling by the owner. Looks like quite a number of old VW made it that far, which can only mean there is a ton more still on the road and not listed for sale.

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/search/cto?query=vw&min_auto_miles=200000

 

[Rmay635703]

Originally Posted by The Critic

Originally Posted by Rmay635703
Unless it's electrically motivated
I would never own an automatic again.

EPA is easy to beat in a manual but impossible to meet in an auto

Maintenance is cheaper and the box is more reliable

Have you priced out the cost of a clutch job on a late-model car that uses a dual-mass flywheel?

From a cost of ownership standpoint, I would rather take my chances on an automatic...


In my 82 diesel suburban the clutch had over 300,000 mostly towing miles , it was aftermarket but still not bad, body rusted out before the clutch

 

[jeepman3071]

Originally Posted by wag123
VW products really haven't improved much. When they are new they have a quality look and feel with excellent driving dynamics and they have always been pretty good vehicles for the first 5 years or 60k miles, then they go down-hill fast when they get older. VW products have been like that forever. Buyers are aware of this fact, that is why they lengthened their warranty. 20 year old 200k mile VWs are rare and always have been, they tend to be "retired" when they get 140 to 150k miles or so on them because they turn into money pits that are not economically repairable. Getting into bed with Ford isn't going to help either one of them IMO.
Mazda's products have improved noticeably since they got in bed with Toyota, just like Subaru's products did over a decade ago.


I disagree on VW. My sister owned a 2001 Jetta, and that thing was a turd. 100k miles before the automatic transmission went belly up, the interior just felt cheap, it burned oil, etc. Her 2013 Jetta is way ahead in build quality. My friend had 270k on his 2010 Jetta 2.5 before he sold it, and it had zero rust and ran great, he just wanted a truck.

 

[OhioMazda]

Originally Posted by wag123
VW products really haven't improved much. When they are new they have a quality look and feel with excellent driving dynamics and they have always been pretty good vehicles for the first 5 years or 60k miles, then they go down-hill fast when they get older. VW products have been like that forever. Buyers are aware of this fact, that is why they lengthened their warranty. 20 year old 200k mile VWs are rare and always have been, they tend to be "retired" when they get 140 to 150k miles or so on them because they turn into money pits that are not economically repairable. Getting into bed with Ford isn't going to help either one of them IMO.
Mazda's products have improved noticeably since they got in bed with Toyota, just like Subaru's products did over a decade ago.


This was my experience with my 2002 Passat 1.8T. It was a pretty good car up to the 11 year/95,000 mile mark (although it did leave me stranded a couple times, at 35,000 due to the infamous broken plastic water pump impeller, and another time at early mileage due to failing coils triggering severe miss & flashing CEL). In the last 5 years I'd spent over $10,000 with the top-rated VW mechanic in a major metro area trying to keep the car alive for my teen son's use. I just scrapped it at 126,000 miles because it had a bum fuel pump ($800 repair), and non-diagnose-able coolant leak.

My understanding is that the user experience of these cars is MUCH better in Germany, where they are considered durable vehicles. My local VW mechanic told me the German-market units are much better-made than those sold in the US. Not sure if this is true, but if true, it's no way to build a brand.