Any Amoco Ultimate Users?
- Thread starter grbr95
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My vehicle called for 87 octane stock but is not stock anymore. With reprogramming to take advantage of more octane I barely feel a difference over 87 octane with proper programming for that. The currently in the works round of mods will mean this will be the fuel I use the most.
What makes you think it has more detergents? Why not just by 87 w/ more detergents (TopFuel) like Phillips66, Conoco, Union76, Chevron, Shell, etc...?
Dave
Dave
Generally, its recommended to only use the octane your vehicle was designed for. My daytona was design ed for example for 87 octane, I have found using higher octane(94 from Sunoco) does nothing for it but take more out of my wallet. If you are concerning about cleaning, I think you'd be best off just running a quality name in gas at the octane your car likes and just running a good fuel system cleaner every few thousand. The cleaner levels in gas is generally pretty low, I know there is a tiny amount of techron in Chevron gas but it is maybe only enough for a maintainence dose.
Run a bottle of techron, regane, BG, whatever your choice is, right before your oil change is scheduled and you should be fine. I really wouldnt buy the ultra high end gas unless your car NEEDS high octane gas, especially at todays very high gas prices.
Run a bottle of techron, regane, BG, whatever your choice is, right before your oil change is scheduled and you should be fine. I really wouldnt buy the ultra high end gas unless your car NEEDS high octane gas, especially at todays very high gas prices.
My only experience in using higher Octane gas
admittedly without smog control adjustments was
with a single cylinder 600 Suzuki MC. My chrome pipe kept getting bluer (hotter) on Chevron Supreme without any more power so I went back to lower octane and the blue went away.
admittedly without smog control adjustments was
with a single cylinder 600 Suzuki MC. My chrome pipe kept getting bluer (hotter) on Chevron Supreme without any more power so I went back to lower octane and the blue went away.
What you need to do is do some research on how your engine is programmed from the factory. For instance, my Dodge Hemi is programmed for 89 from the factory, but after digging around, and after asking some service guys I know who work at Dodge dealerships, I found a tech service bulletin put out by DC that states that the fuel injection programming that the hemis have from the factory will advance timing a bit farther if 90 or 91 octane gas is used, thereby making more power. However, the computer won't advance timing beyond a certain point, so adding gas that's higher than 91 octane won't add any additional power.
Nissans, I know, are the same way. The 3.5L V6 is tuned to run on premium, but you can add either regular or midgrade-as long as you're willing to deal with a 20-25 hp loss. The computer just adjusts the timing based on knock sensor data to account for the lower octane.
The important thing to remember is that no manufacturer's programming will keep increasing timing in response to adding octane-at some point, the computer stops adding timing, regardless of how high the octane rating of your fuel is. So, although premium around here is 93, my computer has its timing advanced as far as it'll go once the blend in my gas tank was 91 octane.
The best places to look and see if your engine will benefit from using a higher grade gasoline are internet bulletin boards that deal with your engine. Look for postings where people have dyno'd their engines with different grades of gas, to see if adding octane added power. You'll find that info fairly easily.
Fitz
Nissans, I know, are the same way. The 3.5L V6 is tuned to run on premium, but you can add either regular or midgrade-as long as you're willing to deal with a 20-25 hp loss. The computer just adjusts the timing based on knock sensor data to account for the lower octane.
The important thing to remember is that no manufacturer's programming will keep increasing timing in response to adding octane-at some point, the computer stops adding timing, regardless of how high the octane rating of your fuel is. So, although premium around here is 93, my computer has its timing advanced as far as it'll go once the blend in my gas tank was 91 octane.
The best places to look and see if your engine will benefit from using a higher grade gasoline are internet bulletin boards that deal with your engine. Look for postings where people have dyno'd their engines with different grades of gas, to see if adding octane added power. You'll find that info fairly easily.
Fitz
M2200b-
The reason your tailpipe was bluer is because premium gas needs more advanced timing to burn completely in the cylinder, since it burns slightly slower than regular gas. Because of that, the fuel/air charge was still burning as it entered your exhaust pipe, increasing exhaust temps. The same would happen if you richened your mixture from the carb-a rich mix tends to cool down your cylinder, but it definitely increases your exhaust gas temps.
Fitz
The reason your tailpipe was bluer is because premium gas needs more advanced timing to burn completely in the cylinder, since it burns slightly slower than regular gas. Because of that, the fuel/air charge was still burning as it entered your exhaust pipe, increasing exhaust temps. The same would happen if you richened your mixture from the carb-a rich mix tends to cool down your cylinder, but it definitely increases your exhaust gas temps.
Fitz
At work I had a ford super duty 7.5 v8. spec for 87. used to ping and knock like crazy on 87 and 89. Amoco 93 was the only gasoline that she wouldn't knock with. I don't know if it was a timing problem or what since the engine has since been replaced.
If your engine has a knock sensor then yes you would benifit from the added octane because the engine will be in a performance tune untill it sees a heavy amount of knock then it backs off and so does HP. If you engine does not have a knock sensor than I would just use a 87 or 89 and run a tank of cleaner thew it every other month. The cleaners in gas on 93 are no were near the amount than if you would add a bottle of techron.
I have noticed on all the lawn gear I use that it runs best on 89 octane oddly enough. Esp the Craftsman mower I use with a B&S engine, it runs odd and "farts" with 87 octane. All the other gear hates 87 and anything above 91 octane for some reason. It all comes down to the engines I suppose. But my car for obviously being a more sophisticated design does best with cheaper 87 lol
My experience deals with an engine without a knock sensor or computerized timing management. This hasn't happened to me, but other owners with the same car have experienced excess carbon buildup in the cylinders when using a higher octane gas than the engine was designed for. Eventually these deposits decreased the cylinder volume so that the car actually became dependent on a higher octane. If you went back to the recommended octane, the car would ping unless you went back to the higher stuff because of the deposits in the engine. This might not have happened on a car with more advanced management.
This problem usually manifested itself when the car was sold and the new owner tried using the recommended type of gas only to find pinging.
The thing to note is that there is no reason to use a higher octane than the car was designed for. The higher the octane, the less volatile it is, so you wind up relying on the computer to change things so the gas will work right. PLUS you are paying more for it in the first place!
Andy
This problem usually manifested itself when the car was sold and the new owner tried using the recommended type of gas only to find pinging.
The thing to note is that there is no reason to use a higher octane than the car was designed for. The higher the octane, the less volatile it is, so you wind up relying on the computer to change things so the gas will work right. PLUS you are paying more for it in the first place!
Andy
I use Ultimate 93 in my R, which is very sensitive to fuel quality. It is the best performing fuel of any I've run in it, including the late Sunoco 94.
As far as detergency goes, BP/Amoco claims their Ultimate exceeds Top Tier standards. But any Top Tier regular grade (Shell comes to mind) should provide good detergency.
I wouldn't run a premium grade fuel in a regular-spec engine just for detergency's sake.
As far as detergency goes, BP/Amoco claims their Ultimate exceeds Top Tier standards. But any Top Tier regular grade (Shell comes to mind) should provide good detergency.
I wouldn't run a premium grade fuel in a regular-spec engine just for detergency's sake.
The car I was speaking of saw 110K in the first 4.5 years I had it, that daily driver enough? I was saying that even with programming to take advantage of octane it was not worthwhile.
Why not just add a fuel system cleaner to Amoco 87 at a small dosage (i.e. FP60) if you're looking for added detergency to keep the engine clean. It'll probably cost less as well. You'd recoup the cost of a gallon of FP60 when used with 87 octane after approximately 175 gallons of gas purchased (assuming a 20 cent difference between 93 octane) and you'll still be able to treat approximately 450 gallons more of gas with the extra FP60.
Or, just not worry about it at all
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Or, just not worry about it at all
I'll second the sentiments already expressed in this thread: Don't run a higher octane than your car needs. Not only is it more costly but you'll increase the likelihood of excessive carbon deposits (I learned this the hard way
)
Use the minimum octane that your car will run well on (give it only the octane the engine demands) and your engine will run clean. Although my car recommends premium, I've been running mid-grade for over two years and FP60 for the past year and my car runs perfectly.
Use the minimum octane that your car will run well on (give it only the octane the engine demands) and your engine will run clean. Although my car recommends premium, I've been running mid-grade for over two years and FP60 for the past year and my car runs perfectly.
I ran ultimate in my '88 5.0 (stock) for a long time instead of 87. After that 'long time' (over a year), it would ping like crazy on anything less than premium.
I have noticed with 87 in my 4.7 dakota. it will run fine for awhile. then seem like it bog down. I will put 89 in every once in awhile. it clears up that bogging feeling. my engine calls for 87. I have ran 93 and saw nothing but as said by others a lighter wallet.
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