What would happen if you mixed these two oils together 50/50. One could then have Amsoil Series 3000 5w-40 Heavy Duty Diesel and Marine, no? How compatible are these two formulas? I wonder if I'm on to something?
Amsoil 5w-30 + 15w-40 50/50 mix?
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I don't think their would be any issues, the main beni being a slightly better cold temp oil and a lowered cost.
I say you have a good idea, worth a try.
If you need a 5w-40 oil why not just use Amsoil 5w-40? ![[Confused]](images/icons/confused.gif)
I thought that oil was intended more for cars. Is that oil OK for turbo diesel trucks? If it is I will give it a try
5W-40 is diesel rated, but not designed for turbo diesels.
I would love to see a shoot out, but the more I think about the blend the more I like it.
[ August 27, 2004, 09:25 PM: Message edited by: Pablo ]
Absolutely, mix them. You obviously know more than the chemists who formulated the oils. You will end up with something maybe a bit better than the 15W-40, and a bit worse than the 5W-30 HDD. Then you can try to figure out the optimum drain interval for the use, keeping in mind that if you are running oil analysis, there won't be a base for the lab to run anything against.
But, then, depending on the engine oil capacity, you will have saved something between $3 and $15.
The 5W-30 handles soot better than the 15W-40, and offers a potential for better fuel economy and further extended drain.
But, if you must dabble, go ahead!!
Pablo, what makes a turbo formula? Whats missing from the euro car oil that would keep it from being good for the PSDs? So you think that 50/50 blend might be worth a try. If you dont see any problems I may just give it a try.
Dick do you think this is a bad idea? I mean it wont really hurt any thing will it?
I just reread and edited my post. I think I had turbo on the brain and left the "diesel" out!
The 5W-40 is not a diesel designed oil. Soot, high CR's, longer drains, new low sulfur fuel, generally longer piston stroke, etc are some of the stresses on a diesel oil.
If one of the worries is the lab won't have a baseline, you can send a virgin blend in, but honestly with the $20 analysis it doesn't matter much and if you are really that worried send them through Terry.
As for the two oils, I'm really hooked on the AME. The HDD is a good oil, but is overpriced. I have several runs on the AME and think it's a great value. Blending the two isn't to outsmart the Amsoil chemists, it's to fit an oil precisely to your car, something Amsoil doesn't think about much.
Does the AME (being full syn) flow better than say Schaeffers blend. My romp issues happen with Delo 400 15w-40 and Schaeffers 15w-40 but never with the 5w-30 HDD. I've never tried a full syn. 15w-40. I dont know if its an oil weight issue or a synthetic vs. dino thing. My blend idea was just to save some bucks. Because of all the 6.0 problems I want to stay within at least 7500 mi drain intervals. I dont want give Ford any reason to question me.
I called Darrin at Amsoil technical and asked him if I could use the 5w-40 in my PSD and he said yes, he said its a "beefy package". He said it would have no trouble going 7500 miles.
I may try it for 5000 and run a Dyson/Blackstone on it just to see what Terry thinks of this oil. I'll be doing it soon too because I hate the romps.
I would say AME flows a bit better.
I do agree with Darren that the 5W-40 can go 7500 miles, but "beefy package" is meaningless BS. Your blend would have a "beefier package" ( ![[Big Grin]](images/icons/grin.gif)
) IMHO.
) IMHO.In extreme cold, I would expect a full synthetic to flow more freely than a non-synthetic or blend with the identical xW rating. At the temperature where the xW is tested, I would expect them to flow at very nearly the same rate.
If you are going to change at 7500 mile interval, then the AME will save you about $28 per fill.
If you are going to use oil analyis to prove that the oil is still suitable for use, without draining, then, at least to me, the HDD would be the choice.
Also rated for heavy duty diesel are the 10W-40 AMO, the 20W-50 ARO, and the semi-synthetic 15W-40 (which will save you another $7 per drain).
Years ago, I just decided to use the best oil I could find, even if it cost me a few bucks a year more.
quote:If this is true then why does Amsoil say it meets CI-4 & CF specs? http://www.amsoil.com/products/afl.htm I've been running Amsoil 5w-40 in my VW TDI (turbocharged direct-injection diesel) for almost 10k miles now. I'll be changing my oil next week when I receive my oil analysis kit from Avlube. We'll see how well the oil holds up in a chipped TDI. And I'll post a comparison between Amsoil 5w-40 and my previous oil analysis using Amsoil 15w-40.
Originally posted by Pablo: The 5W-40 is not a diesel designed oil.
Texas TDI,
I will state up front that the 5W40 Amsoil European Car Formula will probably work in most diesels, I will take Amsoils word for it, this is a diesel car/very light truck oil, and probably perfect for the TDI.
The CI/SL rating only on a bottle for a larger diesel (larger than a TDI) is not a good rating in my book by those letters alone. Look for a combination rating such as CI-4 and CH-4 and SL and SH. Show me one truck rating on the Amsoil 5W40 website, such as Mack/Cummins/CAT etc.
Amsoil has those oils and they are the 5W30 HDD, 15W40 Marine and the 15W40 Semi-Syn. Use diesel car oil in cars, use multi-rated oils in trucks. If in doubt, use Royal Purple 15W40,Mobil I SUV 5W40, DelvacI 5W40. All multi-rated and diesel truck tested.
![[I dont know]](/forums/graemlins/dunno.gif)
quote:I think we are talking semantics. It does meet those specs. But the oil was not ORIGINALLY designed as a diesel oil, as in, Today we set out to make a diesel oil....as are the HDD, AME....
quote:Originally posted by Pablo: The 5W-40 is not a diesel designed oil. If this is true then why does Amsoil say it meets CI-4 & CF specs?
quote:After speaking with a GC chemist friend, he cannot believe the low prices of oil analysis to cover the expense of each test. He feels that it's best not to disclose to the lab what the product is, or the engine, since they can pull out a generic report and give you numbers within the specs, without fully testing the sample. This is something he says is all too common in the petrolchemical industry. This is not to meant to indict Terry or any other laboratory who advertises here, but this issue has come up before on this forum. In fact, Dyson Labs comes highly recommended here. The fact that there is no baseline sample is a little insurance against getting back a report on another persons engine.
Originally posted by Pablo: If one of the worries is the lab won't have a baseline, you can send a virgin blend in, but honestly with the $20 analysis it doesn't matter much and if you are really that worried send them through Terry.
Indeed the Amsoil AME may be an alternative to the romp issue with the 6.0. For a engine that recommends 15w-40 for towing it is troubling to me that romp is an issue on cold start when the outside temp is 50 F and above.
I have mixed the AME and HDD products for years with no problems. Consider that the two chemistries are different and for long drains you may see better oil condition stability by sticking with one over the mix. In any case use analysis as a guide.
Oil analysis quality control in automotive applications can be a sticky issue and since I am not a lab I have to either contract with a lab to handle our kits or use your existing tests. I do find issues with some labs but the good ones are pretty consistent with providing reasonable accuracy over the years. The experienced analyst will spot a " pencil whip" in a heartbeat if worth his salt.
Cost of quality analysis is a consideration unless a sponsor is funding the testing for promotion reasons. You generally do get what you pay for. In general if less than $25 per test be suspect.
Lubricious what does "GC" stand for ? I am assuming Gas Chromatography and not German Castrol !!!
Mass spec Gas Chrom is not easy to interpret and is expensive. Surely he is not holding the spectrograhic elemental analysis to that level of sophistication ? Wish he would contribute here and lend a hand Mass Spec wise to answer base oils questions that so many beg for and are unwilling to shed a few hundred bucks for.
My sources for ASTM quality or higher tech analysis are so expensive I can't afford to offer them to the average consumer enthusiast normally. Now for $5000 I can do lots !
I don't suggest the idea of providing little,no or worst case ,deceptive sample credentials to a lab for automotive analysis.
#1 the average spectro lab is running so many results that they don't care, most of the work is automated( a machine is reading the data out not a human).
#2 You will confuse most analysts who do evaluate the report and get a terribly inaccurate interpretation. Most of the interpretitive analysts are lab techs with lots of LAB experience and lack the education or experience to interpret the results unless they remain within cookie cutter boundaries.
#3 people who send me mystery or deceptive testing don't fool me, just confuse the issue and because I have to spend more time breaking the mystery end up raising my prices! Forensics rates are higher.
I suggest that you find a trustworthy lab and/or preferably a professional analyst to "read" the data for you.
Don't do business with a lab that cannot be trusted. People make honest mistakes and machines fail so don't hammer someone for one mistake or a test machine failure.
I personally attempt to visit my co-op and contract labs and at least observe their work long before I allow my name to be associated with them. If they pull funny stuff I move on.
Having said all that spectro analysis is still a good tool to SAVE the owner money not waste it, yes even with consumer autos.
Terry
[ August 30, 2004, 02:36 PM: Message edited by: Terry ]
quote:My GC freind is both a Gas Chromatographer and a German, but he has never worked for Castrol. I agree that it would be very interesting if he were a contributor to this board.
Originally posted by Terry: . Lubricious what does "GC" stand for ? I am assuming Gas Chromatography and not German Castrol !!! Mass spec Gas Chrom is not easy to interpret and is expensive. Surely he is not holding the spectrograhic elemental analysis to that level of sophistication ? Wish he would contribute here and lend a hand Mass Spec wise to answer base oils questions that so many beg for and are unwilling to shed a few hundred bucks for. Terry
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