So the owner of the company I work for is starting to replace our full size Chevy vans with Ford Transits for better gas mileage. Being we do HVAC work and need to carry a couple of ladders, he took out the passenger seat to fit an 8' ladder in instead of buying a ladder rack. Being this seat has a sensor in it for the airbags which is not in place anymore we get an idiot light come on in the dash airbags disabled. Was wondering what the liabilities were from this? If we where to get in an accident with the airbags disabled on purpose, would insurance even cover it? Is this even legal?
Airbags disabled, liabilities question?
- Thread starter marshall25
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Disabling safety feautres like airbags is illegal. If you got hurt in an accident because the airbag didn't go off, you could sue the company.
Originally Posted By: user52165
Are you sure removing the passenger seat also disables the driver airbag? I would bet not. Does this have a side or curtain airbag for driver also?
Usually if the airbag light is on, the entire airbag system is disabled.
Are you sure removing the passenger seat also disables the driver airbag? I would bet not. Does this have a side or curtain airbag for driver also?
Usually if the airbag light is on, the entire airbag system is disabled.
Originally Posted By: exranger06
Originally Posted By: user52165
Are you sure removing the passenger seat also disables the driver airbag? I would bet not. Does this have a side or curtain airbag for driver also?
Usually if the airbag light is on, the entire airbag system is disabled.
Yep, this is the right answer.
If your state has inspections, the vans will fail. If not, it's still illegal and a huge liability for the air bags to be disabled. Not a smart move to risk a huge lawsuit just to save on some ladder racks. If they are buying new vans anyway, what's an extra few hundred per van for proper racks? A lawsuit over something like this could put the company out of business.
Originally Posted By: user52165
Are you sure removing the passenger seat also disables the driver airbag? I would bet not. Does this have a side or curtain airbag for driver also?
Usually if the airbag light is on, the entire airbag system is disabled.
Yep, this is the right answer.
If your state has inspections, the vans will fail. If not, it's still illegal and a huge liability for the air bags to be disabled. Not a smart move to risk a huge lawsuit just to save on some ladder racks. If they are buying new vans anyway, what's an extra few hundred per van for proper racks? A lawsuit over something like this could put the company out of business.
I would personally not drive the vehicle.I wonder what his insurance co has to say about that too.come to think of it what about warranty?
it is a liability
even so i bet the ins co will pay to put a new one in no matter seat or not. the other ideas sure are smart.
JHZR2
Staff member
Originally Posted By: NHGUY
I wonder if Ford has some sort of fix for that.I can imagine a lot of seats being removed for commercial duty.Afterall,thats the Transits primary market.
+1.
I wonder if Ford has some sort of fix for that.I can imagine a lot of seats being removed for commercial duty.Afterall,thats the Transits primary market.
+1.
Originally Posted By: marshall25
So the owner of the company I work for is starting to replace our full size Chevy vans with Ford Transits for better gas mileage. Being we do HVAC work and need to carry a couple of ladders, he took out the passenger seat to fit an 8' ladder in instead of buying a ladder rack. Being this seat has a sensor in it for the airbags which is not in place anymore we get an idiot light come on in the dash airbags disabled. Was wondering what the liabilities were from this? If we where to get in an accident with the airbags disabled on purpose, would insurance even cover it? Is this even legal?
Doubt the ladder needs an airbag.
What about the side impact airbags available for the back seats of vehicles that don't have back seats?
What about the "turn off passenger airbag" feature on vehicles when someone wants to use a child seat?
How could anybody ever put a child in a front seat (unless it happened to be a car without a back seat, or a 3rd seat)?
Waaaaa! We all need our nanny Guv'ment to protect us, regardless of what it co$t$!
So the owner of the company I work for is starting to replace our full size Chevy vans with Ford Transits for better gas mileage. Being we do HVAC work and need to carry a couple of ladders, he took out the passenger seat to fit an 8' ladder in instead of buying a ladder rack. Being this seat has a sensor in it for the airbags which is not in place anymore we get an idiot light come on in the dash airbags disabled. Was wondering what the liabilities were from this? If we where to get in an accident with the airbags disabled on purpose, would insurance even cover it? Is this even legal?
Doubt the ladder needs an airbag.
What about the side impact airbags available for the back seats of vehicles that don't have back seats?
What about the "turn off passenger airbag" feature on vehicles when someone wants to use a child seat?
How could anybody ever put a child in a front seat (unless it happened to be a car without a back seat, or a 3rd seat)?
Waaaaa! We all need our nanny Guv'ment to protect us, regardless of what it co$t$!
This would be a good opportunity to see what RV conversion companies do in this situation.
In my state, you can be legal if you get a letter from NHTSA allowing you to remove the passenger airbag.
I think to be safe though there should be a cage, to keep stuff from whacking the driver sideways.
In my state, you can be legal if you get a letter from NHTSA allowing you to remove the passenger airbag.
I think to be safe though there should be a cage, to keep stuff from whacking the driver sideways.
What about when you get hit from the right side and end up with a ladder through your stomach? This is crazy!
Originally Posted By: marshall25
Was wondering what the liabilities were from this? If we where to get in an accident with the airbags disabled on purpose, would insurance even cover it? Is this even legal?
Only a lawyer licensed to practice law in your state can answer your questions.
If your state has a workmans comp system, and that is the exclusive remedy against an employer for work related claims, however they are defined, well, that might be it against the employer. Or there might be some way around that.
Third party liability shouldn't be affected by workers comp, but there still could be issues of contributory negligence or comparative fault or assumption of risk or other factors involved specific to your state.
Talk to a lawyer in your state.
Was wondering what the liabilities were from this? If we where to get in an accident with the airbags disabled on purpose, would insurance even cover it? Is this even legal?
Only a lawyer licensed to practice law in your state can answer your questions.
If your state has a workmans comp system, and that is the exclusive remedy against an employer for work related claims, however they are defined, well, that might be it against the employer. Or there might be some way around that.
Third party liability shouldn't be affected by workers comp, but there still could be issues of contributory negligence or comparative fault or assumption of risk or other factors involved specific to your state.
Talk to a lawyer in your state.
Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
Doubt the ladder needs an airbag…..What about the "turn off passenger airbag" feature on vehicles when someone wants to use a child seat?
Reading comprehension fail! Nobody said the ladder needs an airbag. The Transit Connect probably does have the passenger airbag switch. That’s not the point. The point is, when you remove the passenger seat which has sensors in it, you disable the DRIVER’S airbag. The passenger’s airbag is easily defeatable, but the passenger’s seat was never intended to be removed from the vehicle.
Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
What about the side impact airbags available for the back seats of vehicles that don't have back seats?
Simple. Those vehicles don’t have side impact airbags. The ones with back seats do. The cargo vans are very different from the passenger vans. It would probably be illegal to install a backseat in the cargo version. If you want a backseat, buy the passenger version with seats and airbags already installed.
Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
How could anybody ever put a child in a front seat (unless it happened to be a car without a back seat, or a 3rd seat)?
I don’t see what this has to do with this topic. Typically the only vehicles that allow you to disable the passenger’s airbag ARE vehicles without a back seat such as pickup trucks.
Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
Waaaaa! We all need our nanny Guv'ment to protect us, regardless of what it co$t$!
I think I might agree with you. Let the people who are dumb enough to not want airbags get themselves killed in a crash. The world will be better off. I’ll take mine with airbags.
Doubt the ladder needs an airbag…..What about the "turn off passenger airbag" feature on vehicles when someone wants to use a child seat?
Reading comprehension fail! Nobody said the ladder needs an airbag. The Transit Connect probably does have the passenger airbag switch. That’s not the point. The point is, when you remove the passenger seat which has sensors in it, you disable the DRIVER’S airbag. The passenger’s airbag is easily defeatable, but the passenger’s seat was never intended to be removed from the vehicle.
Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
What about the side impact airbags available for the back seats of vehicles that don't have back seats?
Simple. Those vehicles don’t have side impact airbags. The ones with back seats do. The cargo vans are very different from the passenger vans. It would probably be illegal to install a backseat in the cargo version. If you want a backseat, buy the passenger version with seats and airbags already installed.
Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
How could anybody ever put a child in a front seat (unless it happened to be a car without a back seat, or a 3rd seat)?
I don’t see what this has to do with this topic. Typically the only vehicles that allow you to disable the passenger’s airbag ARE vehicles without a back seat such as pickup trucks.
Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
Waaaaa! We all need our nanny Guv'ment to protect us, regardless of what it co$t$!
I think I might agree with you. Let the people who are dumb enough to not want airbags get themselves killed in a crash. The world will be better off. I’ll take mine with airbags.
Originally Posted By: eljefino
This would be a good opportunity to see what RV conversion companies do in this situation.
In my state, you can be legal if you get a letter from NHTSA allowing you to remove the passenger airbag.
I think to be safe though there should be a cage, to keep stuff from whacking the driver sideways.
You don't need to remove the passenger airbag. In fact, removing it does not solve the problem at all. The problem is figuring out a way to remove the passenger seat without disabling the DRIVER'S airbag.
This would be a good opportunity to see what RV conversion companies do in this situation.
In my state, you can be legal if you get a letter from NHTSA allowing you to remove the passenger airbag.
I think to be safe though there should be a cage, to keep stuff from whacking the driver sideways.
You don't need to remove the passenger airbag. In fact, removing it does not solve the problem at all. The problem is figuring out a way to remove the passenger seat without disabling the DRIVER'S airbag.
OP says he has an airbag light. I would get its code. I'm not sure if the driver's side is also disabled or not. That should be the next step.
In a fail safe system, what goes on with the passenger should not also affect the driver. Let's hope some quality engineering went into this.
In a fail safe system, what goes on with the passenger should not also affect the driver. Let's hope some quality engineering went into this.
Originally Posted By: elefino
OP says he has an airbag light. I would get its code. I'm not sure if the driver's side is also disabled or not. That should be the next step.
In a fail safe system, what goes on with the passenger should not also affect the driver. Let's hope some quality engineering went into this.
+1 Agreed. Some previous posters have stated without reservation that a disconnected passenger airbag will also defeat the driver. Why would an auto maker do this? Makes no sense. Further evidence is sought and needed.
OP says he has an airbag light. I would get its code. I'm not sure if the driver's side is also disabled or not. That should be the next step.
In a fail safe system, what goes on with the passenger should not also affect the driver. Let's hope some quality engineering went into this.
+1 Agreed. Some previous posters have stated without reservation that a disconnected passenger airbag will also defeat the driver. Why would an auto maker do this? Makes no sense. Further evidence is sought and needed.
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Originally Posted By: user52165
Originally Posted By: elefino
OP says he has an airbag light. I would get its code. I'm not sure if the driver's side is also disabled or not. That should be the next step.
In a fail safe system, what goes on with the passenger should not also affect the driver. Let's hope some quality engineering went into this.
+1 Agreed. Some previous posters have stated without reservation that a disconnected passenger airbag will also defeat the driver. Why would an auto maker do this? Makes no sense. Further evidence is sought and needed.
Some "previous posters" don't use NextGen in ALL their vehicles!
How dreadful for our sacred Planet Earth!
Cheers!
p.s. I guess there is a real difference in living on the East Coast (where the Guv'ment in D.C. can do all your thinking for you!) and the West Coast, where you are still allowed (MOST OF THE TIME) to actually think for yourself...
Waaaa! I want all taxicabs retrofitted with rearseat airbags!
Originally Posted By: elefino
OP says he has an airbag light. I would get its code. I'm not sure if the driver's side is also disabled or not. That should be the next step.
In a fail safe system, what goes on with the passenger should not also affect the driver. Let's hope some quality engineering went into this.
+1 Agreed. Some previous posters have stated without reservation that a disconnected passenger airbag will also defeat the driver. Why would an auto maker do this? Makes no sense. Further evidence is sought and needed.
Some "previous posters" don't use NextGen in ALL their vehicles!
How dreadful for our sacred Planet Earth!
Cheers!
p.s. I guess there is a real difference in living on the East Coast (where the Guv'ment in D.C. can do all your thinking for you!) and the West Coast, where you are still allowed (MOST OF THE TIME) to actually think for yourself...
Waaaa! I want all taxicabs retrofitted with rearseat airbags!
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Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
I "previous posters" don't use NextGen in ALL their vehicles!
How dreadful for our sacred Planet Earth!
Cheers!
p.s. I guess there is a real difference in living on the East Coast (where the Guv'ment in D.C. can do all your thinking for you!) and the West Coast, where you are still allowed (MOST OF THE TIME) to actually think for yourself...
Waaaa! I want all taxicabs retrofitted with rearseat airbags!
You can't make a good rebuttal or reply to any of the points I made, instead resorting to personal attacks, trying to paint me as some liberal hippy. Did my comment about your lack of reading comprehension strike a nerve? Awwwww, I'm sorry.
Ps. Nextgen was on sale at a price I couldn't pass up, so what? Don't assume things about people you've never met. It makes you look immature.
I "previous posters" don't use NextGen in ALL their vehicles!
How dreadful for our sacred Planet Earth!
Cheers!
p.s. I guess there is a real difference in living on the East Coast (where the Guv'ment in D.C. can do all your thinking for you!) and the West Coast, where you are still allowed (MOST OF THE TIME) to actually think for yourself...
Waaaa! I want all taxicabs retrofitted with rearseat airbags!
You can't make a good rebuttal or reply to any of the points I made, instead resorting to personal attacks, trying to paint me as some liberal hippy. Did my comment about your lack of reading comprehension strike a nerve? Awwwww, I'm sorry.
Ps. Nextgen was on sale at a price I couldn't pass up, so what? Don't assume things about people you've never met. It makes you look immature.
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