ABC: Judge dismisses Alec Baldwin's 'Rust' case after defense claims evidence was withheld.

[vavavroom]

There are about 500 accidental deaths by gun every year in this country. There have been 43 gun-related deaths on movie sets since 1990.

Baldwin did not shoot a fellow actor during the filming of a scene. He jokingly aimed at the DP and hit her fatally and wounded the movie's director.

The armorer had live rounds on the set and used guns used as props for plinking. Bird brains all around. This is neither standard nor normal in this industry.

 

[Jetronic]

Good point, but then how was it a cinematographer who got hit and not another actor?

Never seen a gun aimed at a camera before?

 

[Jetronic]

How’d that work out for Brandon Lee?

I’m sorry, but either the actor has to have some responsibility, or they need to green screen all gun scenes. One can literally “safety check” a revolver simply by looking into the cylinder & then rotating it once to make sure none of the rounds in the cylinder have bullet tips present…

I’ll leave it there because any additional comments would run afoul of board rules.

Bullet tips are visible in revolvers, and might be part of what is shown. They should be dummies but would not look like it. In fact I can't remember seeing obvious blanks in any movie scene....

 

[TiGeo]

There are about 500 accidental deaths by gun every year in this country. There have been 43 gun-related deaths on movie sets since 1990.

Baldwin did not shoot a fellow actor during the filming of a scene. He jokingly aimed at the DP and hit her fatally and wounded the movie's director.

The armorer had live rounds on the set and used guns used as props for plinking. Bird brains all around. This is neither standard nor normal in this industry.

This is what I found as the timeline:

October 21, 2021: Hannah Gutierrez Reed, the armorer for “Rust,” loaded a prop six-shot revolver with what she believed were “dummy” rounds, a term for ammo that contains no explosive elements but appear to be real, according to investigators and her defense attorney.

Baldwin and several crew members began rehearsing a scene in a rustic church on set before breaking for lunch. After the break, Baldwin, Souza, Hutchins and a few others returned to the church for rehearsal.

Assistant director Dave Halls fetched a prop gun from a cart outside the church and yelled “cold gun,” indicating it was unloaded. He then handed the gun to Baldwin.

Baldwin practiced a “cross draw” – pulling a gun from a holster on the opposite side of his body from his draw hand. The scene required him to point the gun toward the camera, helmed by Hutchins, Souza and a camera operator.


Suddenly, they heard a loud bang. Hutchins stumbled backward, slumped to the floor clutching her stomach and said she couldn’t feel her legs. Souza, who had been standing beside her, noticed blood on his shoulder.

 

[TiGeo]

There have been 43 gun-related deaths on movie sets since 1990.

That seems crazy.

Edit. This figure is wrong. 43 TOTAL fatalities all sources...

 

[nickaluch]

I’ll add - if I hire an armorer can I have them give me a supposedly unloaded firearm and wonder into a courthouse with it?

If not - then whoever holds that weapon is responsible.

I'm thinking no firearms are allowed in a courthouse I know by me all bags are searched all walk through a body scan but not sure if that's everywhere

 

[Smoky14]

Bets locally were it would never see a jury. Too much money involved.

 

[TiGeo]

Ah ok 43 fatalities on movie sets since 1990....those are all fatalities not just gun related. Very few of those are gun related (2-3?).

 

[burbguy82]

Nope. Baldwin was the producer and insisted on real guns for authenticity. He wasn’t just an actor holding what he thought was a toy. That’s why they had an armorer.

Treat it as a real gun or don’t use a real gun. It’s real simple.

You are not understanding what I am saying. Yes it was a real gun, but to him, and seemingly everyone else on set, it was a prop, a "non dangerous" thing so to speak.

 

[Jdeere562]

Actors should be trained in gun safety, if they will be handling firearms.

Same with if they will be driving a vehicle. You don't turn a person loose with a vehicle and no experience.

 

[burbguy82]

One can literally “safety check” a revolver simply by looking into the cylinder

Not really, especially a 45 long colt, but I agree with the foundation of what you are saying.

Brandon Lee was hit by shrapnel from a blank if I remember right......a freak accident, not negligence.

The anti gun people of Hollywood , need not to have guns in Hollywood.

 

[TiGeo]

Actors should be trained in gun safety, if they will be handling firearms.

Same with if they will be driving a vehicle. You don't turn a person loose with a vehicle and no experience.

Based on my research they are. The issue here is would the industry standard practices and safety procedures being followed by both the armorer and actor (I posted an example above) have prevented this IF the armorer had live rounds intermingled with dummy ones on set? Maybe?

 

[Astro14]

Brandon Lee was killed by a squib round that had been caught in the barrel and was then discharged at modest velocity by a blank. The gun was checked, loaded with blanks, but they missed the round that had been caught in the barrel from a previous use.

The big issue with this “Rust” event - a loaded gun was on the set.

Baldwin wasn’t “handed” the gun by the armorer. So, it wasn’t checked.

He picked it up off the table to rehearse a scene with the director.

He wasn’t even aiming anywhere in particular, but it happened to be pointed at Halyna Hutchins when he pulled the trigger.

She was just in the room with them.

There is a lot of blame to go around and a young lady died.

Ultimately, the producer of the movie hired an inexperienced armorer, who failed in their duty, and an actor on set ended up with a loaded weapon.

The producer (Alec Baldwin) was more guilty than the actor (Alec Baldwin) and clearly, the court found the armorer culpable.

 

[burbguy82]

The producer (Alec Baldwin) was more guilty than the actor (Alec Baldwin) and clearly, the court found the armorer culpable.

100%

and it is likely that will hold true, in the Civil case against him.

 

[TiGeo]

Brandon Lee was killed by a squib round that had been caught in the barrel and was then discharged at modest velocity by a blank. The gun was checked, loaded with blanks, but they missed the round that had been caught in the barrel from a previous use.

The big issue with this “Rust” event - a loaded gun was on the set.

Baldwin wasn’t “handed” the gun by the armorer. So, it wasn’t checked.

He picked it up off the table to rehearse a scene with the director.

He wasn’t even aiming anywhere in particular, but it happened to be pointed at Halyna Hutchins when he pulled the trigger.

She was just in the room with them.

There is a lot of blame to go around and a young lady died.

Ultimately, the producer of the movie hired an inexperienced armorer, who failed in their duty, and an actor on set ended up with a loaded weapon.

The producer (Alec Baldwin) was more guilty than the actor (Alec Baldwin) and clearly, the court found the armorer culpable.

The details of the event I just posted suggest otherwise to your description here:

Assistant director Dave Halls fetched a prop gun from a cart outside the church and yelled “cold gun,” indicating it was unloaded. He then handed the gun to Baldwin.

In the accounts I read, he was told to point the gun at the camera which the lady was standing behind.

Are there other accounts (I'm sure there are!) that you have found reference to?

 

[Highlander 1459]

as much as I dislike Alec Baldwin. I couldnt see where he was responsible if he was not the armorer on the set..
Admittedly, I never paid attention to this story so I don't know the details but it always sounded like a stretch to criminally charge Baldwin.

 

[tmorris1]

There are about 500 accidental deaths by gun every year in this country. There have been 43 gun-related deaths on movie sets since 1990.

Baldwin did not shoot a fellow actor during the filming of a scene. He jokingly aimed at the DP and hit her fatally and wounded the movie's director.

The armorer had live rounds on the set and used guns used as props for plinking. Bird brains all around. This is neither standard nor normal in this industry.

I agree with this but people are also prosecuted for the accidents. I will never understand why there were live rounds on the set and I will also never understand Hollywood.
It was nice to not have to hear his opinion on things for the last year while he was on trial. Hopefully that continues, but I doubt it. It is just so ironic that the person that claimed to be an expert on what guns you or I should be allowed to have and how dangerous they are ends up killing someone by accident or negligence

 

[eljefino]

Of course it was, not sure why folks here are struggling to understand about this. You go to work, you are told to do XYZ that involves some piece of gear that is the responsilbity of someone else to check for safe use, you use it. That's a normal occurrence in many work places every day w/r to safety b/c it's not realistic to expect everyone doing a job to be an expert/qualified to check pieces of safety gear. This is gear, not a gun at the gun range in this situation. Clearly this system works well as there have been v. v. few incidents like this over the years with all sorts of actors (without checking them) pointing all sorts of real guns at people and pulling the trigger and those guns were checked to ensure the were safe to do so with by a competent person on set. You have a lot of gun-folks here that are having a hard time separating real-world gun use with the 4 safety rules from a movie set where you pointing and pulling the tigger on prop guns which goes completely against those rules so you can be entertained in a movie theater.

Exactly, I at times have to check out a fall protection harness that's inspected by Party A and hook it to a D-ring that was checked by a "competent person." I'm responsible for proper fit but beyond that I have to trust my life to a couple people I haven't even met.

 

[eljefino]

I'd be shocked if all of the responsibility for safety was put into the hands of one or two people in a professionally run movie set where real guns and pyrotechnics are in use. In that situation, EVERYONE attends the safety meeting. Everyone signs the safety agreement. Everyone knows what the safety rules are. Everyone has the authority to yell stop if they see a problem. Etc. Etc.

Gun safety rules aren't too complicated for actors, even children can learn and understand them.

Everyone should know the rules, but there should be a single point of accountability. Inertia, insurance, and standard industry practice make it the armorer. People that want to split the responsibility between the armorer and actor-- ok, who's really, really in control?

 

[eljefino]

Actors should be trained in gun safety, if they will be handling firearms.

They should, both as a SAG (union) general qualification, and with just-in-time briefing from the armorer the day of the shoot with the actual prop and actual blanks being used. Who should give the training? A competent armorer.