93 Toyota 4runner, 5w30 vs 10w30

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Dave9 all motor oil has a little bit of seal conditioning seal agents in them. All of the oils have that in them.

Only difference is high mileage oil has has higher percentage of them.

Dr Molakule on here who has blended oils has told us that all motor oil has seal condioning additives in them.

By the way... I really do like your posts on here. You add a lot of good thoughts on here.
I realize that all have conditioners. The thing is you only want as much as the seals need, not an excessive amount and any more swelling than needed is detrimental.

There seems to be some gross misunderstanding on this forum. You do not want your seals dimensionally swollen, nor any more pliable, than necessary to do their job. Any more than this, increases the wear rate. Wear them, and keep using HM oil and everything may seem fine because they're still swelling more than their dimensions would be otherwise, but you have dimensionally altered and degraded the seal at an accelerated rate. If the engineers wanted the seal to be larger and lower density, they would have used a larger and lower density seal in the first place.

At the same time, using too little seal swellers is detrimental too. You should hold off until you have a reason to use it, and if you're paying close attention this would also mean, using a few quarts, % of HM oil not a switch that added more seal sweller than needed to combat the beginning of the condition.

I'm not talking about total engine devastation overnight, rather that in the long term, it is a "little" bit worse to use HM oil with extra seal swellers than not to, until it's needed... shades of gray, minute differences, is pretty much what all these "which oil should I use" topics are about unless they want to make a drastic change. People want some miracle in a bottle that solves everything and odds are, the bottle is not the solution. Heh, that has a crossover to drinking but I digress.
 
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With a car of that vintage I'd put in whatever is on sale regardless of brand or exact oil weight. Probably any thing at all ranging from 5w30 to 10w40 will work just fine. 5w30 vs 10w30 won't matter. You've already beaten the odds by having the car on the road for this many years. Whatever takes it out eventually won't likely be oil viscosity.
 

SR5

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Frankly, a '93 with that low mileage and climate, I'd get the cheapest major brand 10W40 you can find.…..
No need for high mileage oil if you don't have leaks or excessively burn it, just swelling your seals unnecessarily (nothing good, more wear) otherwise.
Yep, it’s very hard to find “High Mileage” oils in Australia. They are considered a bit of a gimmick. The thinking here is that all oils should be correctly formulated for all cars regardless of mileage.

Generally as the car ages, you step it up a grade, eg go from 0W20 to 5W30 to 10W40 etc.
 

Shel_B

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The amount of seal swell/conditioning is very minimal and unlikely to cause any harm. If the seal swelling was such a concern, these oils would not be able to get Dexos approval.
Some high mileage oils don't have Dexos approval.
 
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Even at 80 degrees, 5w is going to flow quicker at startup than 10w and both are still 30 weight oils. Sorry but I really see no reason to choose 10w-30 over 5w-30.
10w30 being thicker get help an old engine on start up when rings haven't had a the chance to heat and expand making the optimum seal.
 

JimmyG23

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My last oil change, I used Toyota OEM filter and Penzoil high milege oil. I notice the oil was really clear when I poured it in.
 
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10w30 being thicker get help an old engine on start up when rings haven't had a the chance to heat and expand making the optimum seal.
Plz explain in detail how the 10w30 will help. What kind of “seal” are we talking about? Are you suggesting blow by will be getting past the rings until the rings “heat and expand” and somehow a slightly thicker oil will help?
 

Jackson_Slugger

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I realize that all have conditioners. The thing is you only want as much as the seals need, not an excessive amount and any more swelling than needed is detrimental.

There seems to be some gross misunderstanding on this forum. You do not want your seals dimensionally swollen, nor any more pliable, than necessary to do their job. Any more than this, increases the wear rate. Wear them, and keep using HM oil and everything may seem fine because they're still swelling more than their dimensions would be otherwise, but you have dimensionally altered and degraded the seal at an accelerated rate. If the engineers wanted the seal to be larger and lower density, they would have used a larger and lower density seal in the first place.

At the same time, using too little seal swellers is detrimental too. You should hold off until you have a reason to use it, and if you're paying close attention this would also mean, using a few quarts, % of HM oil not a switch that added more seal sweller than needed to combat the beginning of the condition.

I'm not talking about total engine devastation overnight, rather that in the long term, it is a "little" bit worse to use HM oil with extra seal swellers than not to, until it's needed... shades of gray, minute differences, is pretty much what all these "which oil should I use" topics are about unless they want to make a drastic change. People want some miracle in a bottle that solves everything and odds are, the bottle is not the solution. Heh, that has a crossover to drinking but I digress.
Maybe that's why the HM oil blenders call them "conditioners" and not "swellers". Oil leak additives swell and are meant as quick fixes or a last resort before costly replacement. The base oils like AN and POE and additives on HM are meant to condition gradually....
 
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Maybe that's why the HM oil blenders call them "conditioners" and not "swellers". Oil leak additives swell and are meant as quick fixes or a last resort before costly replacement. The base oils like AN and POE and additives on HM are meant to condition gradually....
They used to call them "swellers", either it's a change in formulation or they just wanted to use a nicer sounding word.
 

Jackson_Slugger

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They used to call them "swellers", either it's a change in formulation or they just wanted to use a nicer sounding word.

Maybe some of the follow on oil brands did but Valvoline (the originator of HM oil), emphasized from the start, that it contained "conditioners" and we were told never to say it had "seal swellers":


Proven to Maximize Engine Life After 75,000 Miles

  • The original High Mileage motor oil brand
  • Enhanced anti-wear additives provide 40% better wear protection than industry standards
  • Added detergents help protect against sludge and deposits
  • Premium seal conditioners help treat and prevent leaks
  • Meets the API SP classification protecting the latest engine technology
 
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+1.

You only get the benefits of a 5w-30 below about 15F, and you pay the penalty for it all the time otherwise. In western WA where our lowest temps are only in the high teens very briefly and only some years, plus the trips to the ski slopes, it's 10w-30 in everything, all the time.

Mobil 1 10w30 HM, full synthetic, with the $10/jug rebate on every April to September, comes out to ~$15/jug. Keep that in mind next time. No need to go for a blend at that price.
*Is start up protection better or faster with 5W30 above 15 degrees F than 10W30 ?
*Do current 10W30 synthetic oils (only having the SP rating) have all of the modern additives that 5W30 oils with all the other approvals have ?
 
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*Is start up protection better or faster with 5W30 above 15 degrees F than 10W30 ?
*Do current 10W30 synthetic oils (only having the SP rating) have all of the modern additives that 5W30 oils with all the other approvals have ?

a) answered (no)
b) Yes, or they wouldn't have those approvals.

Personally I look for ACEA A3/B3. The thing you won't find with a 10w30 is the "energy conserving" endorsement or an approval that requires that. They are biased to protecting the engine, not maximizing fuel economy.
 
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