Well, you have a lot of experienced, accomplished hunters by 16, but yes, I agree there is some limit, maybe 12, then with lower caliber lower capacity hardware. All we need to use is COMMON SENSE, but the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
9 year old kid kills gun instructor with auto Uzi
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Originally Posted By: gfh77665
All we need to use is COMMON SENSE, but the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
Agreed on common sense.
On the flip side of the coin were the parents gun nuts thinking it would be a good idea to let a 9 year old play? I am absolutely amazed how stupid the gun range owner sounds not understanding how this happened.
I am very thankful the child did not get hurt physcially as they have no choice in this idiocy. I am can only imagine the psychological damage.
All we need to use is COMMON SENSE, but the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
Agreed on common sense.
On the flip side of the coin were the parents gun nuts thinking it would be a good idea to let a 9 year old play? I am absolutely amazed how stupid the gun range owner sounds not understanding how this happened.
I am very thankful the child did not get hurt physcially as they have no choice in this idiocy. I am can only imagine the psychological damage.
Poor little girl. She's the real victim here.
I hope she will have all the proper help dealing with this tragedy.
I hope she will have all the proper help dealing with this tragedy.
Yeah she's the only REAL victim
Wait.... did an innocent 36 yr old guy DIE?
Wait.... did an innocent 36 yr old guy DIE?
Originally Posted By: rjundi
On the flip side of the coin were the parents gun nuts thinking it would be a good idea to let a 9 year old play? I am absolutely amazed how stupid the gun range owner sounds not understanding how this happened.
How do we know the parents were "gun nuts"? For all we know it could have been the very first time for her to visit a range or even fire anything. Would parents who stupidly let a 9 year old drive (and accidentally kill someone) be a "car nut"?
NO, but because it involved a gun the labels come out.
On the flip side of the coin were the parents gun nuts thinking it would be a good idea to let a 9 year old play? I am absolutely amazed how stupid the gun range owner sounds not understanding how this happened.
How do we know the parents were "gun nuts"? For all we know it could have been the very first time for her to visit a range or even fire anything. Would parents who stupidly let a 9 year old drive (and accidentally kill someone) be a "car nut"?
NO, but because it involved a gun the labels come out.
well a 36 year old can, and is expected, to rely on their own mature adult and fully developed conciousness, whereas a 9 yr old doesn't have that and has to rely on a caretaking adult for that. Thats whats makes it more sad for the little girl. Yes the young man lost his life, which is sad, but the little girl has to live with this for the rest of her life for no fault of hers, which in my opinion is more tragic.
And there is absolutely no sense in opposing setting an age limit for use of guns. Heck there is an age limit for filling gas at the pump!! In my opinion the age limit for gun use should be HIGHER than all of that (gas, alcohol, driving, prescription, consent/consensual.... etc.. everything that you would not want your underage child to do..). How can such a matter of plain simple common sense be even up for a debate ??
And there is absolutely no sense in opposing setting an age limit for use of guns. Heck there is an age limit for filling gas at the pump!! In my opinion the age limit for gun use should be HIGHER than all of that (gas, alcohol, driving, prescription, consent/consensual.... etc.. everything that you would not want your underage child to do..). How can such a matter of plain simple common sense be even up for a debate ??
Well, you cant rent a car until 25. So, that logic don't work.
Like I said, there are some very experienced 16 year olds that are avid hunters that could probably out shoot anyone on this forum. 12 seems reasonable, with small caliber limited capacity arms.
Like I said, there are some very experienced 16 year olds that are avid hunters that could probably out shoot anyone on this forum. 12 seems reasonable, with small caliber limited capacity arms.
Originally Posted By: 97tbird
Wait.... did an innocent 36 yr old guy DIE?
Yes, but he became a victim by being utterly stupid. And now all his worries are over. The poor 9-year-old will be scarred for life.
Wait.... did an innocent 36 yr old guy DIE?
Yes, but he became a victim by being utterly stupid. And now all his worries are over. The poor 9-year-old will be scarred for life.
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Well, you cant rent a car until 25. So, that logic don't work.
Like I said, there are some very experienced 16 year olds that are avid hunters that could probably out shoot anyone on this forum. 12 seems reasonable, with small caliber limited capacity arms.
um..speaking of logic - doesn't that just help prove my point ? That is if you cant rent something that is NOT a killing machine until you are 25 than how can you rent/use a killing machine when you are half that age ?
As for your "logic" about 16 yr old outshooters - Just because there are brainy students in every college and school doesn't mean every student will be a genius. The ratio of teenage drivers dying in car crashes to total teenage drivers is far more than the ratio of adult drivers killed in car crashes to the total adult drivers. Makes sense ?
Well, you cant rent a car until 25. So, that logic don't work.
Like I said, there are some very experienced 16 year olds that are avid hunters that could probably out shoot anyone on this forum. 12 seems reasonable, with small caliber limited capacity arms.
um..speaking of logic - doesn't that just help prove my point ? That is if you cant rent something that is NOT a killing machine until you are 25 than how can you rent/use a killing machine when you are half that age ?
As for your "logic" about 16 yr old outshooters - Just because there are brainy students in every college and school doesn't mean every student will be a genius. The ratio of teenage drivers dying in car crashes to total teenage drivers is far more than the ratio of adult drivers killed in car crashes to the total adult drivers. Makes sense ?
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Originally Posted By: 97tbird
Yeah she's the only REAL victim
Wait.... did an innocent 36 yr old guy DIE?
I guess you see this tragic event as equal in terms of a fully "mature" man making very foolish choices and an innocent little girl?
He died because of his own mistakes. He not only didn't use sound judgment in having a 9 year old fire a fully auto weapon....but he also positioned himself in a completely dangerous position. Sure...he was a victim.....of his poor choices. This little innocent child now must deal with this the rest of her life. She is the "real" victim in that regard.
That's the way I see it.
Why did I even have to clarify my post anyway? Geesh.
Yeah she's the only REAL victim
Wait.... did an innocent 36 yr old guy DIE?
I guess you see this tragic event as equal in terms of a fully "mature" man making very foolish choices and an innocent little girl?
He died because of his own mistakes. He not only didn't use sound judgment in having a 9 year old fire a fully auto weapon....but he also positioned himself in a completely dangerous position. Sure...he was a victim.....of his poor choices. This little innocent child now must deal with this the rest of her life. She is the "real" victim in that regard.
That's the way I see it.
Why did I even have to clarify my post anyway? Geesh.
Poor unfortunate instruction. When i taught my son to shoot( about age 15) , i only gave him one round at a time. This went on for about 50 rounds. That taught him to open the action each time and he understood that the magazine could be empty and a round be in the pipe. Once i knew he could control the firearm and recoil, he got two rounds. Two rounds and that went on for about 100 rounds.
No way would i have a 9 year old handle a fully loaded semi auto pistol, much less a full auto compact weapon.
I hope they get some counseling for her, as that is a huge burden for a 9 year old.
No way would i have a 9 year old handle a fully loaded semi auto pistol, much less a full auto compact weapon.
I hope they get some counseling for her, as that is a huge burden for a 9 year old.
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Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: 97tbird
Wait.... did an innocent 36 yr old guy DIE?
Yes, but he became a victim by being utterly stupid. And now all his worries are over. The poor 9-year-old will be scarred for life.
Very good post...and to the point.
Originally Posted By: 97tbird
Wait.... did an innocent 36 yr old guy DIE?
Yes, but he became a victim by being utterly stupid. And now all his worries are over. The poor 9-year-old will be scarred for life.
Very good post...and to the point.
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
Originally Posted By: rjundi
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
All we need to use is COMMON SENSE, but the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
Agreed on common sense.
On the flip side of the coin were the parents gun nuts thinking it would be a good idea to let a 9 year old play? I am absolutely amazed how stupid the gun range owner sounds not understanding how this happened.
I am very thankful the child did not get hurt physcially as they have no choice in this idiocy. I am can only imagine the psychological damage.
+1
And imagine if she accidently shot her parents.
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
All we need to use is COMMON SENSE, but the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
Agreed on common sense.
On the flip side of the coin were the parents gun nuts thinking it would be a good idea to let a 9 year old play? I am absolutely amazed how stupid the gun range owner sounds not understanding how this happened.
I am very thankful the child did not get hurt physcially as they have no choice in this idiocy. I am can only imagine the psychological damage.
+1
And imagine if she accidently shot her parents.
Originally Posted By: Silk
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
Sadly, a lot of gun owners make the anti gun argument by their ignorant actions.
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
Sadly, a lot of gun owners make the anti gun argument by their ignorant actions.
My wife and I start our kids/grandkids out very early with firearms....they begin with cap guns, progress through airsoft and BB, and begin .22 before progressing to larger firearms. ALL guns are kept in the safe and ALL guns are considered real (we have a holstered pair of cap guns hanging in the safe).
The very first thing they learn is muzzle control and finger off the trigger at all times. Eye and ear protection is mandatory no matter what they're using.
With that said, they are always accompanied by an adult behind them and a helping hand is there if/when needed. Our herd does fire full-auto firearms but they are also very closely supervised.....we have NEVER had a negligent discharge nor an off-target shot with any firearm.
My (now ten year old grandaughter) has been my Range Officer helper for three years and she is very observant to what goes on and I swell with pride when I hear her on videos, "finger off that trigger", "open that action", "your ears are slipping" and etc. She has learned well along with the rest of them.
This incident was caused by an inexperienced "instructor" and a child too unfamiliar and inexperienced with firearms. The instructor allowed her one shot (probably her first ever) and then allowed full-auto. I guess he, very briefly, learned a valuable lesson. I don't blame the parents....I blame the instructor and the range.
The very first thing they learn is muzzle control and finger off the trigger at all times. Eye and ear protection is mandatory no matter what they're using.
With that said, they are always accompanied by an adult behind them and a helping hand is there if/when needed. Our herd does fire full-auto firearms but they are also very closely supervised.....we have NEVER had a negligent discharge nor an off-target shot with any firearm.
My (now ten year old grandaughter) has been my Range Officer helper for three years and she is very observant to what goes on and I swell with pride when I hear her on videos, "finger off that trigger", "open that action", "your ears are slipping" and etc. She has learned well along with the rest of them.
This incident was caused by an inexperienced "instructor" and a child too unfamiliar and inexperienced with firearms. The instructor allowed her one shot (probably her first ever) and then allowed full-auto. I guess he, very briefly, learned a valuable lesson. I don't blame the parents....I blame the instructor and the range.
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Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: Silk
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
Sadly, a lot of gun owners make the anti gun argument by their ignorant actions.
Since when did a few retards somewhere start speaking for everyone? Owners of anything look bad if we go by that measure. Weren't idiots lighting themselves on fire with nail polish remover or something similar? That makes women with pretty toes and fingers look bad?
Originally Posted By: Silk
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
Sadly, a lot of gun owners make the anti gun argument by their ignorant actions.
Since when did a few retards somewhere start speaking for everyone? Owners of anything look bad if we go by that measure. Weren't idiots lighting themselves on fire with nail polish remover or something similar? That makes women with pretty toes and fingers look bad?
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Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: Silk
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
Sadly, a lot of gun owners make the anti gun argument by their ignorant actions.
Nope. Its something like 0.00001%.
Originally Posted By: Silk
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
Sadly, a lot of gun owners make the anti gun argument by their ignorant actions.
Nope. Its something like 0.00001%.
Originally Posted By: youdontwannaknow
um..speaking of logic - doesn't that just help prove my point ? That is if you cant rent something that is NOT a killing machine until you are 25 than how can you rent/use a killing machine when you are half that age ?
So, you saying 24 year olds should not be able to own guns just because rental car companies won't rent to them??? No, car rental co's can not override Constitutional rights of fully grown (24 year old) adults. That would not work at all.
Originally Posted By: youdontwannaknow
As for your "logic" about 16 yr old outshooters - Just because there are brainy students in every college and school doesn't mean every student will be a genius. The ratio of teenage drivers dying in car crashes to total teenage drivers is far more than the ratio of adult drivers killed in car crashes to the total adult drivers. Makes sense ?
Then using your "logic" you would have to prohibit all college students from attending college, just because "not every student will be a genius". No, that does not make any sense at all.
um..speaking of logic - doesn't that just help prove my point ? That is if you cant rent something that is NOT a killing machine until you are 25 than how can you rent/use a killing machine when you are half that age ?
So, you saying 24 year olds should not be able to own guns just because rental car companies won't rent to them??? No, car rental co's can not override Constitutional rights of fully grown (24 year old) adults. That would not work at all.
Originally Posted By: youdontwannaknow
As for your "logic" about 16 yr old outshooters - Just because there are brainy students in every college and school doesn't mean every student will be a genius. The ratio of teenage drivers dying in car crashes to total teenage drivers is far more than the ratio of adult drivers killed in car crashes to the total adult drivers. Makes sense ?
Then using your "logic" you would have to prohibit all college students from attending college, just because "not every student will be a genius". No, that does not make any sense at all.
Originally Posted By: hatt
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: Silk
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
Sadly, a lot of gun owners make the anti gun argument by their ignorant actions.
Since when did a few retards somewhere start speaking for everyone? Owners of anything look bad if we go by that measure. Weren't idiots lighting themselves on fire with nail polish remover or something similar? That makes women with pretty toes and fingers look bad?
Got to look at how the statistics are reported , and the agenda that they are reported with.
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/accidental-injury.htm
Quote:
All unintentional injury deaths
Number of deaths: 126,438
Deaths per 100,000 population: 40.6
Cause of death rank: 5
Unintentional fall deaths
Number of deaths: 27,483
Deaths per 100,000 population: 8.8
Motor vehicle traffic deaths
Number of deaths: 33,783
Deaths per 100,000 population: 10.8
Unintentional poisoning deaths
Number of deaths: 36,280
Deaths per 100,000 population: 11.6
Guns aren't even on the topof the list, but who's heard of the top three "accidental"
Ladders, paracetamol, and prescription drugs are far more dangerous to the average punter than anyone's gun, in anyone's hand is ever likely to be, but a single case (of idiocy) can be used to manipulate the public opinion, and build a case for "proposition X", whatever proposition X may be.
This is a plain stupid incident (not accident, it's highly predictable), but some will use it to further an agenda, and will take every single incident that they can.
Unintentional fall deaths are pretty well equivalent to the total of all intentional firearm deaths (homicides and suicides)...but you never see ladders and high places on the evening news.
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: Silk
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
the gun confiscation/gun control nuts will exploit this.
They don't have to, it's doing very well all by itself.
Sadly, a lot of gun owners make the anti gun argument by their ignorant actions.
Since when did a few retards somewhere start speaking for everyone? Owners of anything look bad if we go by that measure. Weren't idiots lighting themselves on fire with nail polish remover or something similar? That makes women with pretty toes and fingers look bad?
Got to look at how the statistics are reported , and the agenda that they are reported with.
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/accidental-injury.htm
Quote:
All unintentional injury deaths
Number of deaths: 126,438
Deaths per 100,000 population: 40.6
Cause of death rank: 5
Unintentional fall deaths
Number of deaths: 27,483
Deaths per 100,000 population: 8.8
Motor vehicle traffic deaths
Number of deaths: 33,783
Deaths per 100,000 population: 10.8
Unintentional poisoning deaths
Number of deaths: 36,280
Deaths per 100,000 population: 11.6
Guns aren't even on the topof the list, but who's heard of the top three "accidental"
Ladders, paracetamol, and prescription drugs are far more dangerous to the average punter than anyone's gun, in anyone's hand is ever likely to be, but a single case (of idiocy) can be used to manipulate the public opinion, and build a case for "proposition X", whatever proposition X may be.
This is a plain stupid incident (not accident, it's highly predictable), but some will use it to further an agenda, and will take every single incident that they can.
Unintentional fall deaths are pretty well equivalent to the total of all intentional firearm deaths (homicides and suicides)...but you never see ladders and high places on the evening news.
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