7500 manufacturer interval
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Check the section of this board called, "Used Oil Analysis - Gas Engines," and you'll see that some oils in some engines with some driving conditions are no longer protecting the engine way before 7500 miles.
Ken
Ken
Patman
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I'd be downright frightened to see a 5w30 conventional oil's UOA after 7500 miles. Most of the ones we see here after 3k look kinda scary. Maybe 7500 miles if in 60-80F weather, highway only, but certainly not stop and go, short trips and cold weather. Yikes.
(of course, that's why the 7.5k interval is listed as normal, and 3k is severe service)
Patman,
There are scary analyses using M1 at 1.5k. Driving habits seem to more influential in results than oil brand/type.
There are scary analyses using M1 at 1.5k. Driving habits seem to more influential in results than oil brand/type.
Agree. I'm a dino oil user but would not try 7500 miles or anywhere close to that, even if it was mostly easy highway driving. Do folks think that SL dino oils actually can go 7500 miles or so given fairly easy operating conditions?quote:
Originally posted by Patman:
I'd be downright frightened to see a 5w30 conventional oil's UOA after 7500 miles. Most of the ones we see here after 3k look kinda scary. Maybe 7500 miles if in 60-80F weather, highway only, but certainly not stop and go, short trips and cold weather. Yikes.(of course, that's why the 7.5k interval is listed as normal, and 3k is severe service)
All of this begs the question of why manufacturers specify such a long interval and why they do not get more specific in defining 'normal' vs. 'severe' service. Do they simply want people to use worn-out oil for too long, so engine problems develop and owners are enticed to consider a new replacement vehicle sooner than they would if no engine problems occurred?
Honda calls for a 10k oil change interval on cars that hold 3.5 qts including the 1/2 beer can sized filters. I didn't check to see if my mother-in-law's honda civic called for any special 10w20 like ford specs. Anything less than a semi-synthetic would probablly not make it to the 10k interval.
I put Amsoil 10w30 in because it contains less VII than all the other weights and has the lowest volotility. If I remember at the end of 1 year and 15k miles I will do an analysis. So far about 5k miles and 4 months on the oil and non-measurable consumption. Oil still clean.
Mike
I put Amsoil 10w30 in because it contains less VII than all the other weights and has the lowest volotility. If I remember at the end of 1 year and 15k miles I will do an analysis. So far about 5k miles and 4 months on the oil and non-measurable consumption. Oil still clean.
Mike
Patman
Staff member
True, there are some M1 reports I've seen on old TriSyn where 5w30 thinned to 20wt in 2k. But generally speaking, the scariest reports we see on here are dino 5w30s, at least in terms of thinning.quote:
Originally posted by GROUCHO MARX:
Patman,
There are scary analyses using M1 at 1.5k. Driving habits seem to more influential in results than oil brand/type.
I think we need to differentiate between what WE think, based on UOA is not protecting and is the oil actually protecting. I change my '96 VW Passat VR6 at 7500 intervals with whatever oil the dealer uses and VW is giving me a 10/100 miles powertrain warranty based on that. Almost every manufacturer is recommending 7500+ intervals based on normal service and is backing it up with a warranty. You can bet that this is a very padded number to protect themselves. Any named brand dino oil will go 7500 miles with no problems being caused to the engine. Remember, that is what the oil is designed to do, protect the engine not satisfy oil analysis from us picky people that look at every number with a microscope. This is pickyness is causing some people here to post subjects like: "Oh my god! I ran my dino oil to 5K miles, is my engine ruined?!" This based on some UOA that he/she read that that brand they used received a sub-par UOA. Also people not trusting their oil change indicators in their new cars because we say you shouldn't go that far with that oil, come on guys! I haven't seen a single lab that can CONSISTANTLY provide accurate data and it's been proven here several times. You are fine at 5000-7500 miles with an dino oil and long as you check it regularly. If you idle all day in city traffic you might want to go to a 5000 interval.
"I haven't seen a single lab that can CONSISTANTLY provide accurate data and it's been proven here several times."
That's for sure, the variation from lab to lab is what IS frightening.
That's for sure, the variation from lab to lab is what IS frightening.
I think the results I'm getting in my oil study are pretty consistent.
As for consistency from one lab to the next, I don't have any data on that yet. It's a test I'd like to conduct but so far I haven't gotten any volunteers for it. Maybe someday.
While it's easy to use the details of an analysis as a basis for freaking out and changing the oil early, it's also just as possible to use an analysis as part of a big-picture assessment. After all, once a TBN is wiped out, or the insolubles exceed reasonable tolerances, the oil is done for no matter what you choose to make of the details. Although it's good to know that the manufacturer has faith in their engine's design to hold out for 7,500 miles, it doesn't cost that much to have the oil analyzed just once to make sure they're right, *for your driving conditions*.
Then you don't have to talk about theory and what "should" happen -- you'll know for sure.
Cheers, 3MP
As for consistency from one lab to the next, I don't have any data on that yet. It's a test I'd like to conduct but so far I haven't gotten any volunteers for it. Maybe someday.
While it's easy to use the details of an analysis as a basis for freaking out and changing the oil early, it's also just as possible to use an analysis as part of a big-picture assessment. After all, once a TBN is wiped out, or the insolubles exceed reasonable tolerances, the oil is done for no matter what you choose to make of the details. Although it's good to know that the manufacturer has faith in their engine's design to hold out for 7,500 miles, it doesn't cost that much to have the oil analyzed just once to make sure they're right, *for your driving conditions*.
Then you don't have to talk about theory and what "should" happen -- you'll know for sure.
Cheers, 3MP
I have changed my dino Valoline 5W30 every 5,000 miles since new, its now getting close to 40,000. I use about a half pint of oil in that time. A lot of it is at 70 miles per. I am thinking of going to GTX, as from what is said on the forum, like moly. Although the Valoline is doing it great, so not sure if I should or not. What do you guys think?
[ February 28, 2003, 02:37 PM: Message edited by: pruntyc ]
[ February 28, 2003, 02:37 PM: Message edited by: pruntyc ]
I agree on the labs sometimes being all over the map....IF I EVER get my purchased sample kits - I'll be evaluating 4 labs side by side. (20,000 miles on oil....!)
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