(.59 Cent) Chevron 5W-20.... 7,470 mi. Honda 2.4

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106
Location
WI.
7,470 mi. on oil (90 days)...14,950mi. on filter (Honda) Sales car 60/40 hy/city...oil stays hot all day. Report/AVG. Aluminum 3/3 Chromium 1/1 Iron 8/8 Copper 1/3 Lead 0/1 Moly 435/86 Nickel 0/0 Manganese 0/2 Silver 0/0 Titanium 0/0 Potassium 2/1 Boron 17/65 Silicon 8/11 Sodium 92/11 Calcium 1597/2395 Magnesium 8/67 Phosphorus 730/724 Zinc 910/861 Barium 0/0 BlackStone comment: We think it highly unlikely your 45,000 miles Honda engine is leaking anti-freeze into the oil, but that is what the sodium and potassium in this sample suggest. Sodium can be an oil additive though we've not known Chevron to use at as such. Mobil and Castrol do. You engine is wearing perfectly so regardless of the source of the sodium, you can continue on operating the engine normally, but do be on the lookout for loss of coolant. No moisture present. The oil's viscosity was low. If you send in a sample of the Chevron oil we will analyze it for no charge. I paid for TBN but don't see it reported. called B/S. I'm looking to go 10k on oil and 20k on filter..thoughts welcomed!
 
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34,158
Location
Southern NJ
Awesome. Have the same engine and am using the same oil. (Havoline 5w-20 SM). Honda recommends 20k mile oil filter changes correct? What was the viscosity/insolubles? This report is as good as my RL report. How do you drive the car..fast? Also any makeup oil? Sorry for all the questions but your situation sounds a lot like mine.
 
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34,158
Location
Southern NJ
As far as I know, CVX doesn't use Na as an additve. Mobil and Castrol do use it as B/S Labs stated. I paid $1.98 qt for the Havoline. We don't have Chevron on the East coast. It's now the same oil though.
 

doubleshockpower

Thread starter
Messages
106
Location
WI.
Forgot the bottom stuff... Sus Viscosity 51.2/53-62 Report/AVG. Flash point 370/>355 Fuel <.05/<2.0 AntiFreze ?/0 Water 0/<0.1 insolubles 0.4/<0.6
 
Messages
34,158
Location
Southern NJ
The insolubles look good for 15k miles on the oil filter. These Honda 4 bangers are great little engines. Your UOA looks almost identical to mine in terms of wear/fuel/insolubles, but my viscosity was perfect which is a great quality of RL. I also drove 80mph+ on a daily basis hitting 100mph at times for brief spurts....
 
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4,872
Location
MN
The wear metals look good, but I have not seen Chevron with sodium in it, unless this is a 5w20. You might want to look into it, it could be antifreeze.
 
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5,785
Location
Dixie
The sodium level is troubling...I'd check with Chevron and see if they are now using a sodium based, detergent/dispersant additive in this oil. The total solids level is also marginally high, which makes me think you (may) have a very slow coolant leak into the oil. TS
 

doubleshockpower

Thread starter
Messages
106
Location
WI.
Yep, 5W-20 SM (had to order ir special from Checker) **** TBN came back from Black Stone @1.1 Still wondering if 10k mi. in this application is advisable.
 

doubleshockpower

Thread starter
Messages
106
Location
WI.
No coolant loss at all (Chev must have it in the oil) "We think it highly unlikely this engine is leaking anti-freeze into the oil, but that is what the sodium and potassium suggest. Sodium can be an oil additive though we've not known Chevron to use at as such. Mobil and Castrol do. You engine is wearing perfectly so regardless of the source of the sodium, you can continue on operating the engine, but do be on the lookout for loss of coolant. The oil's viscosity was low. Send in a sample of the Chevron, we'll run it for no charge. The TBN was low at 1.1, showing little active additive left. Amended report: TBN value."
 
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34,158
Location
Southern NJ
Why would I be joking about make up oil? Most Honda's use a bit especially if they see high rpm's on a frequent basis. This oil is spent. Don't go any further and in fact I'd cut back to 6k miles. TBN of 2.0 is the cut off limit. You're already below that. Use M1 5w-20 or Havoline Synthetic if you are planning 10k mile drains.
 
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34,158
Location
Southern NJ
**It is possible that the small coolant getting into the oil is depleting the TBN more so than it normally would. That remains to be seen.
 

doubleshockpower

Thread starter
Messages
106
Location
WI.
if the oil is so depleted why isn't it showing much more wear? My wifes '97 CRV @115k uses less oil in 6k than what I'd wipe from the dip-stick. We buy our Honda's new and keep them if their good all around...motor, trans, seats ect....I sold a '01 Accord cause I didn't like to look at it...this '03 was a big overall improvement to the '01.
 
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9,448
Location
USA
If you are putting 7470 miles on the car in a 3 months time frame you should make it to 10,000 just fine with this oil. If TBN is ok you should be fine.Even though you are only talking about a 6 month change interval on the filters I would watch this. You are asking a lot for a filter to take 20,000 miles worth of cold starts and oil pulse's. You might want to consider changeing the filter when you change the oil.
 
Messages
34,158
Location
Southern NJ
I think 10,000 miles is pushing it with this oil. I'd step up to a full synthetic like M1 or Penzoil Platinum. The TBN in this sample is indicating the oil is done. However, if coolant is getting into the oil, then that is a different story and 10k might be possible using this oil.
 

doubleshockpower

Thread starter
Messages
106
Location
WI.
Black Stone did get back to me today on a OCI recomendation: Greg: Thanks for the e-mail. Sorry we did not get to the to the oil change interval. Sometimes we just run out of room. Other than the TBN, nothing was really out of line here, assuming the sodium is not from anti-freeze contamination (and we don't really think it is). The viscosity was slightly low, but it was still in the 20W range, so we really can't complain about it too much. We don't like to see the TBN drop below 1.0 because it means the oil is pretty much out of active additive. It may not hurt anything to run the oil with a TBN lower then this, though it makes us a little leery about recommending a longer oil run. I think you could safely go up to 8,000 miles for the next oil, though you're in uncharted waters if you want to go longer than that. Let me know if you have any more questions. Sincerely, Ryan Stark Blackstone Labs
 
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