2018 VW Golf Sportwagen 48K 3K mid-OCI peek Liquimoly Molygen 5W40 after track weekend/new turbo

[TiGeo]

Changed my oil before I had a new larger turbo installed. Shortly after I did 2 days of HPDE where it got beat on pretty good with sustained triple-digits/near triple-digits and high oil temps so figured I’d have a look at the oil. ~3K on the Liquimoly Molygen 5W40. I expected higher wear metals vs. last UOA from the new turbo b/c that's what I saw last time I swapped the turbo (the 29K UOA) but didn't see them. Just some higher silicon. They primed it per SOP with oil and let it idle for 15 min before driving. I think the oil looks fine or at least on-part with my other data and I’ll go out to 6K or so I think this change. I just used a large syringe I have with some tubing that fit down the dipstick tube – worked perfect for pulling a sample vs. unbolting the belly pan and cracking the drain plug.

 

[dmac_73]

That's a good report. What kind of HP do you estimate with the new turbo?

 

[TiGeo]

That's a good report. What kind of HP do you estimate with the new turbo?

I am putting out about 360+ (depending on temp/quality of fuel/whether I splash in some E85) at the crank which will translate to just north of 300 at the wheels (awd). Best was 384 crank/318 wheel calc'd off scale weight and 1/4 mile trap speed.

 

[edyvw]

That is big viscosity drop for 3k! Flash point is down a lot too.
Go Castrol 0W40 or Mobil1 0W40 for 3K if you do not want to pay for Redline 5W40 or even better Motul 5W40 300V.
You can also try Motul 5W40 Sport.

 

[TiGeo]

That is big viscosity drop for 3k! Flash point is down a lot too.
Go Castrol 0W40 or Mobil1 0W40 for 3K if you do not want to go Redline 5W40 or even better Motul 5W40 300V.
You can also try Motul 5W40 Sport.

I don't disagree. Virgin on that oil was about 13-ish when I had BS run it. I beat on it for that 3K. I may try the M1 that you like so much - however, I've seen several UOAs from it that show it does about the same in these cars/engines, it may start a bit lower though so not as much when you look at the % drop. I think it has some fuel in it here and BS just doesn't run for it specifically. Again, triple digits sustained, lots of boost, lots of just generally beating on the new turbo is going to get some blow-by. My wear metals look great.

 

[edyvw]

I don't disagree. Virgin on that oil was about 13-ish when I had BS run it. I beat on it for that 3K. I may try the M1 that you like so much - however, I've seen several UOAs from it that show it does about the same in these cars/engines, it may start a bit lower though so not as much when you look at the % drop. I think it has some fuel in it here and BS just doesn't run for it specifically. Again, triple digits sustained, lots of boost, lots of just generally beating on the new turbo is going to get some blow-by. My wear metals look great.

The thing is M1 has more Esters and PAO, and it is GTL. It might retain flash point better. Also % drop matters a lot. Per PDS it starts 1.1cst lower.
I think considering engine, upgrades, I would go for Motul 5W40 Sport or even 300V.

 

[TiGeo]

I've seen the Motul 5W40 UOAs that I believe looked about the same as the LM....they are posted here somewhere, I'll repost here to keep the convo going. On flash point - what does that show you? I though it basically was an indication of the amount of fuel (lower = more fuel).

 

[dmac_73]

M1 0w40 FS is impossible to beat for the price.

What was your trap MPH? If you don't mind me asking?

 

[edyvw]

I've seen the Motul 5W40 UOAs that I believe looked about the same as the LM....they are posted here somewhere, I'll repost here to keep the convo going. On flash point - what does that show you? I though it basically was an indication of the amount of fuel (lower = more fuel).

Flash point shows thermal stability, deteriorating flash point, unless fuel dilution (not present here) is indicative of higher Noack.
Also, you track, drop in viscosity could have oil pressure consequences. It is not all about shear stability too. You really do not know how oil will behave until you compare. But, going Motul Sport or 300V you are going with oils made specifically for these kind of conditions.

 

[TiGeo]

M1 0w40 FS is impossible to beat for the price.

What was your trap MPH? If you don't mind me asking?

I use a Dragy which is a high-resolution GPS antenna that you have an app for that allows accurate timing. I've done some 1/4s at the drag track and the times/speeds are close enough to call it good and can be chalked up to the 1' rollout difference with timing lights. With the new turbo, my best run was a 12.36/110.81. Car weighs in with me at 3620 on a CAT truck scale. When lower DAs (colder temps) and taking out the junk (spare, tools, blah blah blah) it will get near 12 and likely in the 113 trap range is my prediction. Here is a cool video from last year with the upgraded but smaller "IS20" turbo I originally upgraded to (the turbo from the GTI - current "IS38" is the turbo from the Golf R). This was a very cold day, some weight reduction, tail wind, basically ideal run and I was using a 30% ethanol blend. Pretty good for a $20K new car with a 1.8.

(1) Unitronic Stage 2 IS20/TCU 1/4 mile Dragy 2018 VW Golf Sportwagen S 4Motion DSG - YouTube

 

[TiGeo]

Flash point shows thermal stability, deteriorating flash point, unless fuel dilution (not present here) is indicative of higher Noack.
Also, you track, drop in viscosity could have oil pressure consequences. It is not all about shear stability too. You really do not know how oil will behave until you compare. But, going Motul Sport or 300V you are going with oils made specifically for these kind of conditions.

Good stuff - will think on!

 

[TiGeo]

M1 0w40 FS is impossible to beat for the price.

What was your trap MPH? If you don't mind me asking?

For sure - I use FCP Euro so get the LM oil change kits for the $21 shipping it costs to return the old ones for a refund - I think that will win the price battle.

 

[dmac_73]

That's a fast car. Enjoy the ride .

 

[TiGeo]

That's a fast car. Enjoy the ride .

It blows minds for what it is...folks can't believe it.

 

[edyvw]

Fast station wagons are always fun bcs. other people disregard them. I had Lancia Lybra 2.4JTD station wagon. That thing was so fast, and would always make other feel they need to engage in some kind of race with me bcs. station wagon.

 

[TiGeo]

Fast station wagons are always fun bcs. other people disregard them. I had Lancia Lybra 2.4JTD station wagon. That thing was so fast, and would always make other feel they need to engage in some kind of race with me bcs. station wagon.

100% - ultimate sleepers! Lancia...the delta hatch was always a car I wanted. The new Audi RS6 is super cool but not when you see the $125K price tag!

 

[edyvw]

100% - ultimate sleepers! Lancia...the delta hatch was always a car I wanted. The new Audi RS6 is super cool but not when you see the $125K price tag!

I was thinking a bit about your engine and power. You are basically running 200hp/ltr there. I am not sure are there open lap days in winter in VA, but in summer, why not running 10W40 Motul or Redline? Or Mobil1 15W50 or 5W50? Liqui Moly has 5W50 Molygen, since you like getting stuff from FCP. I think Mobil1 is better as it is MB229.3 and Porsche A40, while LM is only MB229.1 and no Porsche approval.
Total has 10W50 Racing oil available on Amazon I think $40 for 5ltr.

 

[TiGeo]

I was thinking a bit about your engine and power. You are basically running 200hp/ltr there. I am not sure are there open lap days in winter in VA, but in summer, why not running 10W40 Motul or Redline? Or Mobil1 15W50 or 5W50? Liqui Moly has 5W50 Molygen, since you like getting stuff from FCP. I think Mobil1 is better as it is MB229.3 and Porsche A40, while LM is only MB229.1 and no Porsche approval.
Total has 10W50 Racing oil available on Amazon I think $40 for 5ltr.

I plan on doing another 1-2 HPDE weekends next year for sure...had so much fun but they will be in warmer temps so maybe the thicker oils make some sense. My biggest issue is brakes. Trying a dedicated oil like that may be a good way to go so appreciate the recommendation. Brand isn't that important to me but yeah, FCP is a good deal. I beat on it again yesterday - did a few runs across the "Back of the Dragon" in Tazewell, VA....30 miles of twistys through the mountains. Wagon did great, no issues keeping up with smaller/more nimble GTIs in the group.

 

[edyvw]

I plan on doing another 1-2 HPDE weekends next year for sure...had so much fun but they will be in warmer temps so maybe the thicker oils make some sense. My biggest issue is brakes. Trying a dedicated oil like that may be a good way to go so appreciate the recommendation. Brand isn't that important to me but yeah, FCP is a good deal. I beat on it again yesterday - did a few runs across the "Back of the Dragon" in Tazewell, VA....30 miles of twistys through the mountains. Wagon did great, no issues keeping up with smaller/more nimble GTIs in the group.

Yeah, that power is too much for those brakes. You need some serious stuff there. WHy not try Ferodo DS2500? Or PFC line?
But I think ultimately you need R brakes.
Mobil1 15W50 is dedicated track oil, and it is $24 for 5qt in Wal Mart. My friend is using in his BMW M5 with Dinan tune (close to 700hp) that Liqui Moly 5W50.

 

[TiGeo]

Yeah, that power is too much for those brakes. You need some serious stuff there. WHy not try Ferodo DS2500? Or PFC line?
But I think ultimately you need R brakes.
Mobil1 15W50 is dedicated track oil, and it is $24 for 5qt in Wal Mart. My friend is using in his BMW M5 with Dinan tune (close to 700hp) that Liqui Moly 5W50.

The base Golfs have 288s up front and 272 out back. I swapped my fronts to 312s like the base GTIs have and running yellows up front and Motul 600 fluid seemed ok. The R brakes are where I will likely end up (340s) and can even go up a size in teh back to the GTI performance pack brakes. Issue is that they are heavy - BBKs save a lot of weight but they also are just too much money in my opinion. With the R brakes, they are known to work but ideally you should swap to the R master cylinder as well. I was able to get up to 130 on the track so slowing from that cooked my original setup.