2016 Toyota Camry SE 2.5L auto with Redline D6 too slippery

[nn88]

Hello all

First post here. I have heard of this forum (fairly notorious actually) and I have read certain threads.

Anyway, my question is in regards to the title.

We got this car at 84k miles from Hertz used car sales, and now its at 135k miles. I do not know the service history, but it was a Hertz fleet car so it must have been serviced. But I don't know if the trans was serviced, or what fluids.

I have done 2 drain and fills of the transmission with Redline D6 (at 125k and 128k), and the old fluid was very dark brown/black with lots of detritus on the magnets on the first DF with pan drop + clean + filter. No pan drop on the 2nd DF. The trans holds 6.9 quarts of fluid so it now has roughly 75% new Redline D6 fluid.

When the car is hot, and say I get off and on the freeway while its still hot, when accelerating pretty quickly back onto the freeway it has some transmission slippage, or a gear is not fully engaging quick enough, maybe 2 to 3 or 3 to 4.

I read a thread here about adding some racing Redline ATF to help with slip agent problems.

I was just wondering if anyone has advice for fixing this slipping problem, besides going back to Toyota OEM WS atf fluid. I know I can always do that.

What about Maxlife ATF, does it also have slip problems like Redline D6? what about Redline D4? Also, since my trans only has 6.9 quart capacity, how much of the racing redline should be added given I have about 75% Redline D6 in it already? Thanks for any help

 

[kschachn]

You should contact Redline and ask them.

 

[nn88]

You should contact Redline and ask them.

Alright.

Question Kschachn: have you rebuilt your 1999 Toyota Sienna (engine and or trans) over the 446k miles? That's a lot of miles.

Also my question was geared more towards another thread I found about mixing racing redline with D6:

Redline D6 ATF substituting for Toyota WS

I am planning to get the Toyota Venza ATF drain/ fill at the dealer and bring my D6. What has been the forum experience with D6? Initially ATF changed @40k mi and refilled with WS I do not tow.

bobistheoilguy.com

Sorry about not referencing the thread, but my question was trying to gather input about mixing redline D6 with racing RL (or other fixes):

Mainia said:
"I run D6 in my wife's 2014 Rav4......I myself always add 1 qt of Redline Racing and one qt Redline Racing low viscosity ATF (Type-F basically) to reduce the slip agents in D6 because I think it has too much agent for my liking."

I'm not sure what Redline will actually say or be able to say in regards to this topic. We'll see I guess. I just submitted my question.

 

[drtyler]

I had a negative experience using Red Line D4 in an application for Toyota T-IV. The 1st to 2nd upshift would slip, especially under higher throttle. I drove it like that for 3000 miles with hopes it was a fluke.

It did not disappear until I swapped all the Red Line D4 for T-IV fluid. I have been very suspect of all-in-one ATFs since then, especially for Toyota vehicles.

That said, many here claim to have good service from Maxlife ATF in these.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Welcome to BITOG

Maxlife will be fine in your Camry. Another good choice is Castrol Full Synthetic ATF. Toyotas aren't usually picky with ATF, so it must be a problem with Redline.

 

[The Critic]

Have you adjusted the fluid level properly?

 

[Delta]

Didn't some of these cars have torque converter issues? Although I would think there would be a shudder associated with that rather than a slip.

Maxlife is a favorite among DIY Toyota owners who have a transmission spec'd for WS.

 

[MrPlow]

Valvoline Maxlife all vehicles ATF, FTMFW.

I run this in both of my Toyota auto trans and my father's 4th gen 4runner trans, and it performs flawlessly. Perfectly crisp and smooth shifts.

I don't think I would run anything else, honestly. At least as long as it meets the requirements of the tranny.

 

[nn88]

Redline got back to me quickly:

"Thank you for contacting Red Line Oil, the D6ATF would be recommended in your RAV4 automatic, a suitable replacement for the WS ATF matching closely it’s slipperiness and isn’t too slippery. Some will blend the Racing ATF trying to make a less slippery fluid, this is possible though if the slipperiness is reduced too much lock up clutch shudder can result."

They misread my comment, thinking I had a RAV4, but I did mentioned my 2016 Camry. Nevertheless, they do mention mixing a small amount of racing Redline ATF to reduce slipperiness.

Yes, I did make sure the ATF fluid level was correct using a laser temperature gun for the fluid to be between 104-113 deg F during top off.

So now the question is... for anyone who's so inclined to offer helpful thoughts:

Do I do another drain and fill with Maxlife ATF to reduce the slipperiness? This would result in a Redline D6 53.7% and Maxlife ATF 43.5% mixture, 10.2% old fluid. (DF is roughly 2.9 quarts, no pan drop. Total fill is 6.9 quarts)

Or do I drain out ~0.75-1.0 quarts of the current fluid and add .75 quarts of Redline racing ATF? I do not want to drain all the Redline D6 out, if possible, because its expensive and works fine, just a little slippery.

Thanks for your thoughts

BTW I use Maxlife ATF a lot as well, $20 a gallon, can't beat it for a synthetic ATF. Its just that in this case I already had 2 old but sealed gallon jugs of Redline D6 sitting around from a 2002 BMW 325i I used to have which I never used and wanted to get rid of it and the jugs said that it was WS approved.

 

[MrPlow]

Redline got back to me quickly:

"Thank you for contacting Red Line Oil, the D6ATF would be recommended in your RAV4 automatic, a suitable replacement for the WS ATF matching closely it’s slipperiness and isn’t too slippery. Some will blend the Racing ATF trying to make a less slippery fluid, this is possible though if the slipperiness is reduced too much lock up clutch shudder can result."

They misread my comment, thinking I had a RAV4, but I did mentioned my 2016 Camry. Nevertheless, they do mention mixing a small amount of racing Redline ATF to reduce slipperiness.

Yes, I did make sure the ATF fluid level was correct using a laser temperature gun for the fluid to be between 104-113 deg F during top off.

So now the question is... for anyone who's so inclined to offer helpful thoughts:

Do I do another drain and fill with Maxlife ATF to reduce the slipperiness? This would result in a Redline D6 53.7% and Maxlife ATF 43.5% mixture, 10.2% old fluid. (DF is roughly 2.9 quarts, no pan drop. Total fill is 6.9 quarts)

Or do I drain out ~0.75-1.0 quarts of the current fluid and add .75 quarts of Redline racing ATF? I do not want to drain all the Redline D6 out, if possible, because its expensive and works fine, just a little slippery.

Thanks for your thoughts

BTW I use Maxlife ATF a lot as well, $20 a gallon, can't beat it for a synthetic ATF. Its just that in this case I already had 2 old but sealed gallon jugs of Redline D6 sitting around from a 2002 BMW 325i I used to have which I never used and wanted to get rid of it and the jugs said that it was WS approved.

Maybe try a drain and fill with Maxlife, and if that doesn't work do another drain and fill or have a fluid shop do a fluid exchange to get most of it changed in one shot (costs a lot though). ATF can go quite a lot of miles before needing to be changed. If it was me, and this is exactly what I do, is just do the expensive fluid exchange route and be happy I'm running nearly 100% of the proper fluid and then forget about it for a few years.

 

[The Critic]

Not sure where the temp sensors are located, but generally, there will be a difference between an IR thermometer’s temp and the unit’s temp sensor.

I would try setting the fluid level at about 95F and getting more fluid into the transmission.

 

[nn88]

I can do the cooler hose method of flushing out most of the trans fluid. I just prefer not to. And I do not want to waste the $50+ per gallon Redline D6 if possible, =).

Also, I do not want to pay a mechanic to flush the trans fluid. I would probably only use a trans mechanic for a trans rebuild. Although I would like to try to rebuild one myself some day.

I guess I'm going to seriously consider a DF with Maxlife. Its been running great, both after the 1st DF with Redline, and after the 2nd DF with Redline, just some infrequent slippage. I don't think a DF MaxLife will hurt, and its only $20.

 

[nn88]

I know what you mean about a laser temp gun outside the drain pain probably being slightly lower than the actual, and that a 95 deg F would be a better top off temp. I actually have a FoxWell NT530 bidirectional scanner (with Toyota Software) that measures the trans fluid temp, and I did use that actually. I forgot what I did because its a been a while.

I will be able to see if it is low when I do a MaxLife ATF DF, and I will use both my laser temp gun and scanner to see how close they are.

 

[doublebase]

I’m not helping any with this comment, but I have to ask...was the transmission shifting properly with the WS fluid in it before you switched the Redline? If so, is there a specific reason why you want to stick with the Redline or Maxlife?

I‘ve owned a few Toyota’s/Lexus and ive always just used the WS. Pan drops, filter replacements, temp check. Done. Then simple drain and fills every 50,000 miles thereafter.

WS does get incredibly dark very quickly from the factory, but after that initial drain, for some reason it doesn’t. Don’t know why. But good luck to you with the Redline. Top of the line products.

 

[nn88]

Well, when I did the first pan drop at 125k miles, the fluid looked so bad... and the filter and magnets so packed.... I was kinda shocked (and worried).

Did it shift bad (or slip) before I used Redline D6? I don't think so... but then I wasn't that attentive to it until after I started servicing everything. I believe it shifted how its supposed to before I service the trans fluid with Redline D6. Now mind you this is a pretty minimal slippage that happens pretty rarely. If it was a worse problem I would have taken action a while ago.

I just read somewhere yesterday.... that the reason it looks so bad on the first DF was due to the clutch pack burn-in on new Toyotas... and hence why on future DFs it does not look so bad. That seems to be a good answer...

I'm actually not against using OEM fluids... its just that I would like to look around for full synthetic options … that both work just as good as OEM … as well as hold up longer to lengthen the life of the transmission, if possible. I don't really care that much... I just want my car to last 300k+ miles...

Since I do all my own maintenance (as well as family and friends)… I am able to save a ton of money on vehicle cost of ownership. Its kind of a hobby of mine to learn about auto mechanics and try figure out how to fix stuff ...

 

[MolaKule]

Hello all

First post here. I have heard of this forum (fairly notorious actually) and I have read certain threads.

Anyway, my question is in regards to the title.

We got this car at 84k miles from Hertz used car sales, and now its at 135k miles. I do not know the service history, but it was a Hertz fleet car so it must have been serviced. But I don't know if the trans was serviced, or what fluids.

I have done 2 drain and fills of the transmission with Redline D6 (at 125k and 128k), and the old fluid was very dark brown/black with lots of detritus on the magnets on the first DF with pan drop + clean + filter. No pan drop on the 2nd DF. The trans holds 6.9 quarts of fluid so it now has roughly 75% new Redline D6 fluid.

When the car is hot, and say I get off and on the freeway while its still hot, when accelerating pretty quickly back onto the freeway it has some transmission slippage, or a gear is not fully engaging quick enough, maybe 2 to 3 or 3 to 4.

I read a thread here about adding some racing Redline ATF to help with slip agent problems.

I was just wondering if anyone has advice for fixing this slipping problem, besides going back to Toyota OEM WS atf fluid. I know I can always do that.

What about Maxlife ATF, does it also have slip problems like Redline D6? what about Redline D4? Also, since my trans only has 6.9 quart capacity, how much of the racing redline should be added given I have about 75% Redline D6 in it already? Thanks for any help

Well, you do have a used transmission in which the ATF fluid condition and change history is in question.

My experience is that used or off-lease vehicles never have the ATF changed.

Redline D6 and Valvoline MaxLife use the same type of DI (additive) package so the frictional specs should be very close.

I would suggest doing at least two more drain and refills (with filter change if it has one), with ILI's Lubegard RED added on the next fill as per the bottle's instructions.

Hopefully all you have is some slight varnish buildup in the valving and possibly some clutch assembly particulates still floating around.

 

[meep]

I did the mix-n-match fluids thing a long time ago but it’s not my favorite. If you like boutique fluids like redline but can’t quite get it right, consider a move to amsoil. ive used both amsoil and maxlife and prefer amsoil by a hair - it seems to have ever so slightly a quicker engagement than maxlife. I’ve used both, depending on who for, in a tundra, Lexus GS, and a couple of camrys.

m

 

[Leo99]

I did 2 drain and fills in my 2015 camry with max life and no problems. I would double check the fluid level. That temperature based drain plug thing seems like a problem to me. I measure what comes out and put the same back in.

 

[vetteryan]

Following

 

[Delta]

Another thought here you might want to scan the car to see if you have a pending P2714. There seems to be several topics of the such and it seems this is around the mileage some of these transmissions go. They start doing the minor shift flare/slipping and then all Hell breaks loose, even with a fluid change. The fact you mentioned the original fluid was very nasty coming out is another warning sign. Might be a coincidence that you felt this happening after the fluid change, but you might have not been as attentive to it beforehand.

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