2014 Mazda3 2.0L / Honda 0W20 / 8000km OCI

[JimmyD]

I was very curious to analyze this oil as it's the Canadian 08798-8023C part number which is supposedly still manufactured by Idemitsu. As the Mazda oil w/moly is also manufactured by them, I wanted to see what the moly count was... turns out Honda does not add extra moly to their mix. I'm very happy with the results, though. The lab is spot on about the dilution; I idle my car more than I should in the winter, but I did give it a good 15 minute highway run to redline several times immediately prior to changing the oil. My prior fills were the Castrol 0w20 edge (with Titanium) before I started using the Honda oil about 35k ago, and I've only ever used the OEM filters. NOTE: these figures are in Kilometers! I'll be sticking to the 8000km OCI until my powertrain warranty is up.

 

[tig1]

Where are the wear metals with 20wt oils?

 

[Artem]

20wt? I think this has diluted into the teens category now. It's like 0w19. Lol. Excellent looking report, OP. I love my 2014 Mazda 3 as well. Mazda did an awesome job on it.

 

[OVERKILL]

Wow, that's turned into an xW-12

 

[JimmyD]

Originally Posted By: Artem

20wt? I think this has diluted into the teens category now. It's like 0w19. Lol.

I was surprised by this too! But such little wear. I kind of figured that my dilution would be higher with such a hit to viscosity but maybe the dilution figure is off (I guess it's not a particularly exact measurement). My oil didn't smell like fuel or anything nor did the level increase noticeably. I was reading about your mods; I'll likely get the OrangeVirus tune after my powertrain has expired.

 

[paulri]

Quick question here, because I think about this every time someone says they do a lot of fast driving, just before the oil change, to clear out water & gas: what is the point of doing this? Isn't the idea of a UOA to see what is in your oil? Wouldn't it be better to know IF there is excess water or gasoline in the oil, rather than to remove any that is there, before you could know for sure? Not trying to rain on your parade, just curious. I agree with the others, that your 0w16 oil (oh I'm sorry, 0w20) protected your engine just fine.

 

[JimmyD]

Originally Posted By: paulri

Wouldn't it be better to know IF there is excess water or gasoline in the oil, rather than to remove any that is there, before you could know for sure?

That's a good point. I figured that my sample would be higher in water and fuel due to my winter driving habits. I changed my oil at work (my commute is only about 8 miles/13km, although I'm usually hard on the pedal) so I mostly wanted to make sure the oil was properly up to temp and circulated prior to pulling the sample. I think it was 20 below that day... edit: also, I see a lot of UOAs saying "we see extra fuel in your oil, and we think it's because of excessive idling/low speed driving". If I razzed the car before taking my sample, and I STILL had excessive fuel, I'd rather know that as it could indicate a larger problem.

 

[PimTac]

Great looking report with super low wear metal counts.

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: paulri

Wouldn't it be better to know IF there is excess water or gasoline in the oil, rather than to remove any that is there, before you could know for sure?

Well it engines aren't designed to be operated in - constantly operating the vehicle without letting it fully warm up before you shut it off. I wouldn't be surprised to see massive condensation and byproducts in the oil. Once you drive the car a good distance like you're suppose to, everything cooks off. Obviously if you only operate in short city bumper to bumper traffic during your whole OCI, definitely sample the oil during your typical driving cycle to see the condition of the oil during 90% of the car's actual use and not the random 10% occasional use.

 

[wemay]

Another report showing significant dilution with insignificant wear. Great report.

 

[PimTac]

Originally Posted By: wemay

Another report showing significant dilution with insignificant wear. Great report.

Yep and it is more proof that today’s modern oils are capable of handling these conditions and yet deliver the protection they should.

 

[Danh]

Originally Posted By: PimTac

Originally Posted By: wemay

Another report showing significant dilution with insignificant wear. Great report.

Yep and it is more proof that today’s modern oils are capable of handling these conditions and yet deliver the protection they should.

Up to a point. On the CRV forums there seem to be lots of owners in cold weather locales whose Honda 1.5Ts have been incapacitated by fuel dilution and are awaiting a fix from Honda. The owner most far along in the process is getting a new engine as lots of metal was found in the engine oil. May be an extreme case but does show even modern oil has its limits. We’ll have to see how the other CRV owners fare.

 

[JimmyD]

Danh, do you have a link for that CRV thread? Did they have an UOA performed?

 

[DBMaster]

It has been stated quite a few times on BITOG that Blackstone's flash point testing for fuel dilution is not terribly accurate compared with the chromatography test used by some other labs. I had a UOA done on oil from my 2012 Mazda3 (Skyactiv) after 30,000 miles using the microGreen filters. The oil was M1 0W-20 AFE. I'm not super savvy when it comes to interpreting the viscosity numbers, but the others who saw my numbers indicated that my oil had actually increased in viscosity enough to resemble a light 30 weight.

 

[PimTac]

Originally Posted By: Danh

Originally Posted By: PimTac

Originally Posted By: wemay

Another report showing significant dilution with insignificant wear. Great report.

Yep and it is more proof that today’s modern oils are capable of handling these conditions and yet deliver the protection they should.

Up to a point. On the CRV forums there seem to be lots of owners in cold weather locales whose Honda 1.5Ts have been incapacitated by fuel dilution and are awaiting a fix from Honda. The owner most far along in the process is getting a new engine as lots of metal was found in the engine oil. May be an extreme case but does show even modern oil has its limits. We’ll have to see how the other CRV owners fare.

Would you not consider this to be a specific case related to the Honda 1.5 Earth Dreams Engine? I wonder if Honda has made any changes to the engine itself? This Mazda example seems to be their early SkyActiv though I’m not sure if that. The SA engines have had better success with fuel dilution but it still was apparent. The 2017 engines saw a new piston ring and piston changes which seem to handle the fuel dilution much better according to early reports. Of course long term we do not know.

 

[Artem]

Mine is also 2014 and I have no fuel in my samples after 4K miles. Fuel problems like this must be driving style / conditions related more so then the actual engine itself. I am using 93 octane though, which is technically needed for a 13:1 compression engine, regardless if Mazda says 87 is ok.

 

[Danh]

Originally Posted By: JimmyD

Danh, do you have a link for that CRV thread? Did they have an UOA performed?

Hard to do on a tablet, but go to CRVownersclub.com, then to “Problems and Solutions” then to “2017 LX 1.5T Internal Engine Problem”. Lots of discussion but conclusion on page 5. I don’t believe the owner had a UOA performed, but I believe an oil sample was sent to Honda by the dealer.

 

[JimmyD]

Originally Posted By: Artem

Mine is also 2014 and I have no fuel in my samples after 4K miles. Fuel problems like this must be driving style / conditions related more so then the actual engine itself. I am using 93 octane though, which is technically needed for a 13:1 compression engine, regardless if Mazda says 87 is ok.

The dilution in my sample is most certainly due to driving habits. I let the car run as long as is needed for the idle to come down to somewhat normal levels (clutching into first with Skyactiv fast idle is a cringeworthy experience). This time of year this can range from a minute to three-four, depending how cold it is out. As noted, my commute isn't very long either. I've been making a point to use Shell 91 (the best commercially available in my region) as it's advertised as ethanol free and it doesn't soot up my exhaust tips like regular 87 does. I'm sure that I'd have seen far more dilution running regular. I'll likely do an UOA after I drain my summer oil in early fall to keep up on the dilution.

Originally Posted By: Danh

Hard to do on a tablet, but go to CRVownersclub.com, then to “Problems and Solutions” then to “2017 LX 1.5T Internal Engine Problem”. Lots of discussion but conclusion on page 5. I don’t believe the owner had a UOA performed, but I believe an oil sample was sent to Honda by the dealer.

Thanks! I love reading up on this stuff. There's a ton of drama on the civicx forums regarding the new 1.5T, although most of it is coming from guys running insane tunes. Lots of fuel dilution issues going on there it seems.