2008 528i - ZF trans - 185k miles on Original ATF!

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6. The BMW owner should take their car to BMW dealership for service

7. Pay with their credit card for transmission service

8. Friendship is not destroyed by trying to be nice
 
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
If it were my car, I'd change the ATF.
In a car belonging to someone else, I'd leave it alone.


Nailed it.

If, for some reason, I decided to buy a neglected 185K mi 2008 528i, and if I decided for some reason that I would keep the car, the fluid would get changed. Even knowing the total lack of maintenance history on it, I would still do the fluid change. I am a firm believer that a fluid change alone will not cause a transmission to go from "fine" to "broke," and if anything bad were to happen to the trans, it was coming anyway.

But I would bet the owner of the car has no concept of that whatsoever. More than likely, all they know is you want to replace some mysterious fluid in some mysterious part. Should the mysterious part act up after the fluid change, that could be a problem for you, as least as far as any future relationship with this person.

Now if the owner says, "I know I may be too late anyway, but I want to change the fluid out, can you help me out?" Maybe...MAYBE, I would lend a hand.

I would not get yourself on the hook with a car like this by suggesting how things should have been done.

Hate to assume/stereotype, but am I correct in guessing that the owner of the car is not the original owner, and the car was purchased because it was an '08 BMW at a "great price," mileage be [censored]? If so, do not touch the transmission, and don't do the oil pan either.
 
Something the dealer told me, which may or may not be true, is that with a fluid change in one of these you have to clear the learned values. While it seems unlikely to me, you do have to register battery replacements, so ...

BTW my dealer does not want to change our fluid, but said they will do it for about $1k which includes the pan, fluid, (bolts?), labor and separate computer time.

I might look into replacing the mechatronic sleeve at the same time if I were going to do it myself. Apparently they frequently leak as miles pile on, requiring removing the drain pan.
 
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Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
6. The BMW owner should take their car to BMW dealership for service

7. Pay with their credit card for transmission service

8. Friendship is not destroyed by trying to be nice



LT4, you've been on this forum for a while, and I appreciate you looking out for me. I know you're a smart guy, so let's be a bit more respectful about BMW owners (and high-line car owners) in general. Just because someone owns a higher-end does not mean that they deserve to overpay for service. And neither does it mean that they are stupid. Perhaps you've had some bad experiences in the past with friends/family who owns these cars, but in the big picture, it is quite unfair to lump all of the owners into one group.
 
Originally Posted By: 01rangerxl
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
If it were my car, I'd change the ATF.
In a car belonging to someone else, I'd leave it alone.


Nailed it.

If, for some reason, I decided to buy a neglected 185K mi 2008 528i, and if I decided for some reason that I would keep the car, the fluid would get changed. Even knowing the total lack of maintenance history on it, I would still do the fluid change. I am a firm believer that a fluid change alone will not cause a transmission to go from "fine" to "broke," and if anything bad were to happen to the trans, it was coming anyway.

But I would bet the owner of the car has no concept of that whatsoever. More than likely, all they know is you want to replace some mysterious fluid in some mysterious part. Should the mysterious part act up after the fluid change, that could be a problem for you, as least as far as any future relationship with this person.

Now if the owner says, "I know I may be too late anyway, but I want to change the fluid out, can you help me out?" Maybe...MAYBE, I would lend a hand.

I would not get yourself on the hook with a car like this by suggesting how things should have been done.

Hate to assume/stereotype, but am I correct in guessing that the owner of the car is not the original owner, and the car was purchased because it was an '08 BMW at a "great price," mileage be [censored]? If so, do not touch the transmission, and don't do the oil pan either.

The owner is not a car guy, but is starting to become one, in the interest of keeping this car longer.

With that said, he purchased this car as a CPO back when it had around 30k on it, so he's owned it for the majority of its life. He wasn't ignorant, he just simply followed the BMW recommendations (at the time).

He's simply asked me to bring things up to date for him, with the intent of keeping the car for another two years or so.

I told him to do the tension struts for now, and to pass on the oil leak. But he wants the oil leak fixed, so...

I haven't brought up the transmission service matter in detail, but I did casually mention that a 185k old transmission on the original fluid is on the borrowed time. At this point, I don't think he's put 2 and 2 together yet...
 
That's somewhat high mileage but the factory fill is synthetic so it should be OK. I would change it no worries, might be spent but we're not talking about dex 3 with 200k miles on it, this old fluid needs to be changed! I bet theres no huge junk in there just sheared and dirty.
 
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
4. They will eventually learn that a transmission needs servicing after it blows up

5. Not his car, so no need to get his hands dirty



Took the words right out of my mouth.

OP is NUTS if he touches that car.
crazy2.gif
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No good deed goes unpunished.

If you have a BMW you can afford to take the car into a professional shop and pay for the service, that way if there is a problem they can deal with it.


+ Same here.

Unless it's a she and you have have some affinity for each each other's "mechanisms"
grin2.gif
I'd run too.
 
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I'd tell him to look for a European indie to do the change. The liability is too high even if it die 30k down the road. People don't always tell you what they think when they blame you in their heart.
 
So I discussed this matter with the owner, and he's in agreement that it is too risky to service the transmission at this point.

Instead, I told him that I would start sourcing a replacement transmission for him to install.
 
Believe it or not, even at ridiculous miles, the ZF pans are usually pretty clean, to the point of wondering why you even bothered replacing them in the first place.

If it were me, I'd get transmission money lined up, and then flush the SOB. Worst case scenario, I'm doing what I was planning to do anyway. Best case scenario? Booze money.
 
Originally Posted By: The Critic
So I discussed this matter with the owner, and he's in agreement that it is too risky to service the transmission at this point.

Instead, I told him that I would start sourcing a replacement transmission for him to install.


Hang on, is the transmission on the verge of failure? I remember you mentioning in your opening post that it is shifting just fine?

Why source a replacement if the original is working?
 
Originally Posted By: chrome
Why source a replacement if the original is working?

Agreed. I'm not following this either. You might as well start sourcing a new engine, because it, too, will at some point fail.
 
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: chrome
Why source a replacement if the original is working?

Agreed. I'm not following this either. You might as well start sourcing a new engine, because it, too, will at some point fail.



There's little reason to believe that the engine is of immediate concern. On the other hand, while the transmission works fine for now, it's days are probably numbered since it already has 185k...and on the original fluid.
 
How much is this car worth, considering the mileage? $8K? How much would a new trans and labor cost?

If you're really worried that the trans is about to die, wouldn't it make more sense just to sell the car now and get something else?


FYI, if we had to pay for it out of pocket, a new trans and labor on the wife's C300 would have been $8K. Maybe a bit less if done at an indy shop.
 
Honestly, I think sourcing a replacement tranny is premature. Your co-worker should definitely get the fluid changed, and probably the filter/pan as well, but I would NOT be the one to do it if I were you.

I think I remember reading about this ZF tranny, or possibly a similar model. The OEM fluid was crazy expensive, but owners have had luck with some aftermarket fluids - it might have been MaxLife. With fluid cost like that, I would seriously look at an aftermarket fluid. Definitely do some homework here to see what's worked, and what hasn't. I believe this tranny was also used in some VW and Audi models.
 
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
Believe it or not, even at ridiculous miles, the ZF pans are usually pretty clean, to the point of wondering why you even bothered replacing them in the first place.

If it were me, I'd get transmission money lined up, and then flush the SOB. Worst case scenario, I'm doing what I was planning to do anyway. Best case scenario? Booze money.


Never flush. For old transmissions, small drain and fills are the way to go. Replace only a small fraction of the ATF at a time, using the fill tube or access port (not sure if either are available here). If you can get a MityVac tube into it somewhere, you're good to go.
 
Ok, here's a thought: Let's say a replacement trans is priced out, and the owner is ok with the cost/effort. At that point, why not replace the fluid? Worst case scenario is that the trans dies, and he is out the fluid cost. Best case is that trans chugs along another 100k+. I realize it's $400 down the drain if it dies; but I'd have to wonder if it's truly in bad shape in there or not.
 
Just drive it. I know of a number of 722.6 transmissions with lifetime fluid deep into the 200k range. Lifetime fluid sometimes really is lifetime.

The gear box could fail tomorrow or roll 300k no problem, who knows.

For $8k I'd trade the car in on a new one.
 
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