'13 WRX: Mobil 1 ESP 5w30, 6,590 mi

[WRX12tt]

Second interval on Mobil 1 ESP 5w30, pretty happy with how it's doing. I was planning on running it to about 6,000 miles (see previous UOA on 4/21/14), but a road trip put me over a bit. Easy street driving, 1,000 mile road trip and autocross events on this oil. OEM Subaru blue oil filter. The oil used to top up was a mix of ESP 5w30 and Castrol Edge Professional OE 5w30 I had laying around.

Code:

Oil----------------------  Factory Fill ------ Edge OE 5w30---Pennzoil Platinum 5w30---	Pennzoil Ultra 5w30--- Mobil 1 ESP 5w30--- Mobil 1 ESP 5w30--- Mobil 1 ESP 5w30--- Universal Averages
Miles In Use               3,002               4,048	      3,351			4,547		       4,889	       	   7,216	       6,590
Miles on Unit              3,002               7,050	      10,401			14,948		       19,837		   22,164	       28,754
Date Changed               2/1/13              5/10/13	      8/05/13			11/11/13	       2/28/14		   4/21/14	       9/05/14
Make up Oil Added--------- 0 Qts. ------------ 0 Qts. ------- 0 Qts. ------------------ 0.6 Qts. ------------- 0 Qts. ------------ 1.0 Qts. ---------- 0.85 Qts.

Aluminum------------------ 7 ----------------- 9 ------------ 6 ----------------------- 5 ---------------------4 ----------------- 4------------------ 4 ----------------- 4
Chromium                   1                   1              1                        	1		       1                   1  		       1		   1
Iron                       34                  16             14                      	11		       10                  13                  10	           9
Copper                     27                  9              7                        	5		       3                   4                   4		   9
Lead---------------------- 0 ----------------- 0 ------------ 0 ----------------------- 0 -------------------- 0 ----------------- 1 ----------------- 1		   3
Tin                        4                   3              2                        	0		       0                   0                   0		   1
Molybdenum                 1079                435            118                      	70		       81                  82                  78		   73
Nickel                     0                   0              0                        	0		       1                   0                   0		   0
Manganese                  2                   1              1                        	0		       0                   0                   0		   1
Silver-------------------- 2 ----------------- 1 ------------ 0 ----------------------- 1 -------------------- 1 ----------------- 1 ----------------- 1 ----------------- 0
Titanium                   0                   1              0                        	2		       0                   0                   0		   1
Potassium                  2                   2              2                        	1		       0                   1                   0		   2
Boron                      198                 26             6                        	60		       126                 105                 93		   46
Silicon                    89                  19             10                      	5		       4                   5                   5		   10
Sodium-------------------- 8 ----------------- 6 ------------ 1 ----------------------- 2 -------------------- 3 ----------------- 4 ----------------- 4 ----------------- 30
Calcium                    2105                1777           2388                     	2422		       1218                1235                1200	           1919
Magnesium                  12                  6              12                       	15		       6                   8                   5		   415
Phosphorous                892                 680            725                      	798		       695                 714                 715		   825
Zinc---------------------- 1082 -------------- 802 ---------- 831 --------------------- 842 ------------------ 778 --------------- 855 --------------- 857 --------------- 974
Barium                     2                   1              0                        	0		       0                   0                   0		   0

SUS Viscosity @ 210F------ 52.4 -------------- 66.1 --------- 58.9 -------------------- 57.3 ----------------- 62.8 -------------- 63.5 -------------- 64.3 -------------- 56-63					
cSt Viscosity @ 100C       7.99                11.91          9.91                     	9.44		       11.0                11.21               11.41		   9.1-11.3
Flashpoint in F            405                 435	      405                      	425		       410                 435                 445		   >365
Fuel                       <0.5                <0.5           <0.5                     	<0.5		       <0.5                <0.5                <0.5		   <2.0
Antifreeze %-------------- 0.0 --------------- 0.0 ---------- 0.0 --------------------- 0.0 ------------------ 0.0 --------------- 0.0 --------------- 0.0		   0.0
Water %                    0.0                 0.0            0.0                      	0.0		       0.0                 0.0                 0.0		   <0.1
Insolubles %               0.2                 0.3            0.1                      	0.3		       0.4                 0.2                 0.2		   <0.6
TBN                        N/A                 2.8	      N/A			5.2                    3.0                 1.5		       2.2
TAN----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2.2		   4.6		       2.3

 

[timeau]

Looks good. Also you have chosen right time to change oil: TBN should not be less than TAN.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Just curious, why have you chosen this particular oil?

 

[WRX12tt]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete

Just curious, why have you chosen this particular oil?

I wanted an oil with good viscosity retention and an oil that meets Subaru's warranty requirements of 5w30 and API SM/SN. Most Resource Conserving 5w30s in a Subaru EJ engine tend to shear to a 20 grade after a couple thousand miles. If they allowed 0w30, GC would be a great choice. Once my powertrain warranty is up, I'll probably switch to Rotella T6 5w40 or Mobil 1 0w40.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: WRX12tt

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete

Just curious, why have you chosen this particular oil?

I wanted an oil with good viscosity retention and an oil that meets Subaru's warranty requirements of 5w30 and API SM/SN.

I see. The reason I asked is that ESP 5w-30 is a low SAPS oil, and this in turn will restrict you to short(er) OCI, but it sounds like you're OK with that.

Quote:

Most Resource Conserving 5w30s in a Subaru EJ engine tend to shear to a 20 grade after a couple thousand miles.

Even if they do, does it have some proven negative effects?

 

[WRX12tt]

Quote:

Even if they do, does it have some proven negative effects?

Those much smarter than me on the Subaru forums have come to the conclusion that a less robust oil makes the motor much more susceptible to rod bearing failure. Spun rod bearings seem to be quite common on Subaru EJ motors. Even though many people probably do not have any issues on an RC 5w30 - it's just an extra level of protection to run a non-RC oil in my opinion. Especially since I do some autocross events.

 

[buster]

0w40 is another good choice here. Nice results.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

This is a perfect example of why in the US you cannot do long drains on a gasser with ACEA C3 oil. ULSG is clearly required.

 

[Impatient]

I really want to listen and ask, not "tell." But for '13 WRX, is Subaru OK with 6-7K OCI's? Officially they aren't on older turbo's, such as my 07. Doesn't look like shear was any sort of problem on your UOA. I've been looking into datasheets, and ESP caught my attention....even the 0-30. I have a new mechanic; among other things, he pulled the engine to do timing belt & clutch at same time...needed an oil change too. He put in some sort of Amsoil, and it seems to have really quieted the engine down. Really! He wanted to use 10-40 Premium, but I asked for 5-30 Signature. I can't swear what he actually did, but later he claimed it was the lower XL 5-30(at my request??). Previously I ran normal M1 5-30, which he hates. Anyway, I may stick with the XL, or I may switch back to some sort of M1 for routine self-changes. Have to admit, no issues with the XL so far, but that's anecdotal, not backed by any analysis. I would really like to do 6K changes (twice a year) so have a "winter" fill and a summer fill. Here in N Texas, 10-40 might make perfect sense in the 105 degree summer, but a 5-30 might be better in the winter. I know this isn't Fargo, ND, but I'm on a freeway within 2 minutes of start-up, and so I want low-as-possible 40 degree viscosity in the winter. I recently discovered HTHS specs, so arbitrarily, I would like to stay above 3.5. Your ESP fits the bill...as does the 0w30 ESP. Now off-topic, but Amsoil's series 3000 HDD has great visc specs, and zinc, but I haven't figured out whether HDD is REALLY OK in gassers like the Subaru. I was intrigued by the rabid GC fans, but it appears that world is changing: I see 0-40 SN Edge "GC" now, instead of the older "real" Syntec 0-30 SL at local Autozone. And the 0-40 M1 might be a safe bet...in the summer at least. FWIW, the 40 degree visc of the 0-40 is much higher than the 5-30 (???). So much for the conventional wisdom that 0w is thinner than 5w at moderately low temps.

 

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted By: Impatient

I really want to listen and ask, not "tell." But for '13 WRX, is Subaru OK with 6-7K OCI's? Officially they aren't on older turbo's, such as my 07. Doesn't look like shear was any sort of problem on your UOA. I've been looking into datasheets, and ESP caught my attention....even the 0-30. I have a new mechanic; among other things, he pulled the engine to do timing belt & clutch at same time...needed an oil change too. He put in some sort of Amsoil, and it seems to have really quieted the engine down. Really! He wanted to use 10-40 Premium, but I asked for 5-30 Signature. I can't swear what he actually did, but later he claimed it was the lower XL 5-30(at my request??). Previously I ran normal M1 5-30, which he hates. Anyway, I may stick with the XL, or I may switch back to some sort of M1 for routine self-changes. Have to admit, no issues with the XL so far, but that's anecdotal, not backed by any analysis. I would really like to do 6K changes (twice a year) so have a "winter" fill and a summer fill. Here in N Texas, 10-40 might make perfect sense in the 105 degree summer, but a 5-30 might be better in the winter. I know this isn't Fargo, ND, but I'm on a freeway within 2 minutes of start-up, and so I want low-as-possible 40 degree viscosity in the winter. I recently discovered HTHS specs, so arbitrarily, I would like to stay above 3.5. Your ESP fits the bill...as does the 0w30 ESP. Now off-topic, but Amsoil's series 3000 HDD has great visc specs, and zinc, but I haven't figured out whether HDD is REALLY OK in gassers like the Subaru. I was intrigued by the rabid GC fans, but it appears that world is changing: I see 0-40 SN Edge "GC" now, instead of the older "real" Syntec 0-30 SL at local Autozone. And the 0-40 M1 might be a safe bet...in the summer at least. FWIW, the 40 degree visc of the 0-40 is much higher than the 5-30 (???). So much for the conventional wisdom that 0w is thinner than 5w at moderately low temps.

Subaru of America allowed 7,500 mile OCI's in turbos from MY 2011-2014 and do not actually automatically put turbo models under severe service like the pre-2011 turbo models. For 2015, SoA back-pedaled a bit reducing the OCI's to 6k miles for normal service and 3k for severe. Brand is not important if you want to maintain oil viscosity over the oil interval. Look at HTHS. Yes; Amsoil HDD is an excellent choice IMO. There are a couple of uoa's on it from WRX's posted here. -Dennis

 

[Impatient]

I hope I can find those Amsoil HDD UOAs, as I appear to be somewhat search-impaired. So no real danger to the cat? Back to OP's topic, sort of, if viscosity & TBN are good, what might be the downside of low SAP...in our Subaru's? I know I am asking about HDD, which I assume is very high SAPS. Also would M1 0w40 be considered a mid-SAPs or hybrid? It has more zinc than any other normal M1, but I realize zinc isn't part of S-A-P-S. Other way to word my overall question, what really seems to matter to a Subaru Turbo EJ25? There must be some reason normal M1 5-30 gets so rag'd? Going to 10-40, or even 5-40, seems like, well, I wonder if the cure is worse than the disease. I would think the ultimate would be the thinnest oil (at all temps) that provides needed protection and lubricity ...at all temp extremes we see. After all, thin oil can still pass thru all our clogged little banjo screens.

 

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted By: Impatient

I hope I can find those Amsoil HDD UOAs, as I appear to be somewhat search-impaired. So no real danger to the cat? Back to OP's topic, sort of, if viscosity & TBN are good, what might be the downside of low SAP...in our Subaru's? I know I am asking about HDD, which I assume is very high SAPS. Also would M1 0w40 be considered a mid-SAPs or hybrid? It has more zinc than any other normal M1, but I realize zinc isn't part of S-A-P-S. Other way to word my overall question, what really seems to matter to a Subaru Turbo EJ25? There must be some reason normal M1 5-30 gets so rag'd? Going to 10-40, or even 5-40, seems like, well, I wonder if the cure is worse than the disease. I would think the ultimate would be the thinnest oil (at all temps) that provides needed protection and lubricity ...at all temp extremes we see. After all, thin oil can still pass thru all our clogged little banjo screens.

Thin oil gets ragged because of the low HTHS and Subaru turbos are just tough on oil. It's best to search using google and something like "Amsoil HDD WRX UOA bobistheoilguy" . http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2583966

 

[Impatient]

Thanks Dennis. What would be your take on mixing normal m1 5-30 with m1 0-40 (or some other m1), to get to a thicker oil. I like whatever Amsoil got put in last time, but I've got 7 qts of that m1 5-30 to use up.

 

[Greasymechtech]

Mixing 0w40, 5w40, or even a 10w40, can give your M1 5w30 the extra you might need for dealing with an engine that is tough on oil. 50:50 is a good starting point. Nothing wrong with low saps oils. Not everyone cares for extended intervals. Makes me wonder if they would be a better choice for oil burners and oil injected engines. Perfect interval for that oil and excellent UOA. Besides euro dealer sourced oil and ESP, RedLine/Amsoil have low saps euro 5w30.