10.3k miles Valvoline 5W-20 Adv Full Syn (API SP) - 2019 Mustang GT

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Where is the boron going???

In the next installment of will 10k mile drain intervals / 5W-20 weight oil destroy my Mustang’s engine we’ve got Valvoline Advanced Full Synthetic. Unlike the last test with Mobil 1 we’re now in the API SP era and this data was collected over a 1 year 3 month period and saw a solid winters worth of cold weather driving in the north east. Driving was ~60/40 city/highway split.

This time around I took a sample at 200 miles to act as a baseline, figured that would give the new oil enough time to work through the engine and blend in with the leftover old oil. Wear metals certainly get cleaned out but you can see there’s still 10 ppm of Al/Fe/Cu carried over. 6/25/6 ppm -> 3/5/2 after the change.

4oz of fresh oil were also added each time a sample was taken to get a better handle on changes to the viscosity and TBN.

Ignore the particle count data that was for something else I was trying to test. Starting (200 mile) TBN value got covered up by that data, it was 4.9, and at the end it was 2.4 I don’t know why it’s not showing up on the sheet.

Viscosity started at 7.56 cSt, started thin out a bit during the last 2000 miles but it didn’t go out of grade.

Wear over the interval was very low. Starting with 3/5/2 ppm of aluminum iron and copper it ended with 4/20/3. That’s like 1.7 ppm per thousand miles, and steady over the run. It’s not like things are spiking at the end because the oil has worn out.

One thing I really notice was how much the boron levels dropped over the 10k mile run. 127 ppm -> 37 ppm. The only thing I can figure is this has to be boron used as a dispersant that’s getting caught up in the filter over time. If it was used for antiwear like zinc and phosphorus you shouldn’t she the levels significantly drop over time.

If that’s the case then it seems like boron would be one of those markers to keep an eye on when determining if the oil additive package is used up. Maybe folks keep an eye on that but I haven’t seen folks really talk about boron levels like viscosity TBN or oxidation

Anyway Valvoline went the distance and held up. I’d use it again in a heartbeat and that’s not because I grew up in the city where the company was founded and briefly based.

Poo poo group 3 oils all you want but my coyote thinks they’re just dandy

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One thing I really notice was how much the boron levels dropped over the 10k mile run. 127 ppm -> 37 ppm. The only thing I can figure is this has to be boron used as a dispersant that’s getting caught up in the filter over time.
That is correct. The HPL HDEO I have run in the past saw levels of boron drop as the miles increased. When I asked @High Performance Lubricants why, he said the boron compound will be depleted as the contaminants are carried to the filter.

See the boron trend in this table:

 
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Wait, 5W-20 and > 10k OCI? That can't be! There's videos of smart people telling us you are destined for engine failure soon.
In a 480 hp V8 with a 12:1 compassion ratio that revs to a modest 7500 rpm, you know a real low stress environment for engine oil.

The only two things I should say about my driving is that I never short trip so the oil always heats up and I never push the engine until the oil temp reads “normal” which seems to be around 130F since installing a real oil temp gauge.

When I started doing this the idea was to take the major off the shelf brands and see how their basic formulas stacked up to Pennzoil Ultra Platinum and Amsoil. Something to shove in PF fans faces along with all the YouTube mechanics preaching oil Fudd lore but my problem now is that I’ve gotten into tracking my car so 10k mile runs just don’t happen.

Maybe I need to find something fun with a small displacement turbocharged 4 banger daily and use that for long interval testing.

I’m thinking of doing a comparison next year between 0w-40 oils on the track. Pennzoil makes a 0w-40 ultra platinum so I could put it head to head against one of the four/five flavors of Mobil 1 0w-40, Amsoil, and I’d have to go through PF videos to pick a few other oil brands his one arm bandit concluded were trash.

It’d also be nice to find a lab willing to do HTHS viscosity testing to really see if there’s been sheering damage but that’s not easy to find.
 
Like @wwillson mentioned Boron gets depleted but to add further that it shows this depletion on a UOA whereas other additives may be depleted but still show up in full on the UOA b/c it doesn't get filtered etc. API SP is going to show lower wear regardless due to break-in on previous SN+. Looks good though & appreciate your dedication to your UOA per ODI. Nice work!
 
I'm still waiting for someone to show UOA data on the same car say 3x each 20 vs. 40 grade over a normal 5-10k OCI in normal driving and any material difference in the UOA wear metal rates/1k miles.
 
130 f oil temp is "normal"?
That’s the low end of normal. The non-Shelby s550 mustangs don’t come with an actual oil temp sensor, it’s just an inferred value. I put a sensor in the other year and have observed the cars meter goes from cold to normal around 130 degrees eventually reaching 200-205.
 
If that’s the case then it seems like boron would be one of those markers to keep an eye on when determining if the oil additive package is used up. Maybe folks keep an eye on that but I haven’t seen folks really talk about boron levels like viscosity TBN or oxidation
I keep spreadsheets of my UOAs and one of my trackers is "Boron Depletion". For purposes of the spreadsheet, I assume boron depletion is linear (which I know it may not be) and predict at how many miles it will be zero. Most of the time it lines up very closely to TBN depletion.

There are a few oils I've tested where boron depletes at half the rate of normal:
Pennzoil Euro L API SN
Castrol Euro 5W30 A3/B4 (the API SL version)
Castrol Euro 0W40 (older API SN version)

They must be using a different type of boron.
 
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I'm still waiting for someone to show UOA data on the same car say 3x each 20 vs. 40 grade over a normal 5-10k OCI in normal driving and any material difference in the UOA wear metal rates/1k miles.
That’s something I could try at the track next year, I wouldn’t go as low as a 5w-20 right away but I could run 5w-50 for a day then do a 5w-40 day and then 5w-30.

I do actually have a long-ish daily driving run going on right now using 5w-30 since I wasn’t able to get to the track as much as I hoped to this year. It’s with Castrol Edge EP though and my Castrol 5w-20 data used regular Edge. Not a perfect comparison but it will be interesting to see the results.
 
It’d also be nice to find a lab willing to do HTHS viscosity testing to really see if there’s been sheering damage but that’s not easy to find.
From the data I've seen, HTHS tends to drop around half as much as KV100 does after shear thinning (in percentage terms).

This oil dropped from 8.0 cST to around 7.2 cST, or 10%. If HTHS started at the minimum 2.6 cP, it would have dropped by around 5% to 2.47 cP, equivalent to almost half a grade.
 
Wear over the interval was very low. Starting with 3/5/2 ppm of aluminum iron and copper it ended with 4/20/3. That’s like 1.7 ppm per thousand miles, and steady over the run. It’s not like things are spiking at the end because the oil has worn out.
From 200 miles to 6.2k miles, iron was 1.15 ppm / 1k miles. The remaining two intervals were 2.5 and 1.5 ppm / 1k miles. Though, the largest increase was from November to March. If you've got cold winters, that's probably the reason.
 
From 200 miles to 6.2k miles, iron was 1.15 ppm / 1k miles. The remaining two intervals were 2.5 and 1.5 ppm / 1k miles. Though, the largest increase was from November to March. If you've got cold winters, that's probably the reason.
Northeast US so the car sees a lot of cold starts in below freezing temperatures. Winter definitely has an impact, I have a run with Castrol Edge 5w-20 that caught the tail end of one winter and was changed before the next one, the average Al+Fe+Cu wear dropped down to like 1.3-1.4 ppm/1k miles.
 
I'm still waiting for someone to show UOA data on the same car say 3x each 20 vs. 40 grade over a normal 5-10k OCI in normal driving and any material difference in the UOA wear metal rates/1k miles.
Another interesting experiment would be to compare UOA wear metals on same vehicle with 2 oils of same viscosity with only difference being oil A having low levels of anti-wear additives (phosphorous + zinc), and oil B having a generous dose of anti-wear additives.

I know UOA's are not designed for that comparison, and any difference in wear metals would be considered within the margin of error.
But still it would be useful to know.
 
Another interesting experiment would be to compare UOA wear metals on same vehicle with 2 oils of same viscosity with only difference being oil A having low levels of anti-wear additives (phosphorous + zinc), and oil B having a generous dose of anti-wear additives.

I know UOA's are not designed for that comparison, and any difference in wear metals would be considered within the margin of error.
But still it would be useful to know.
Check out my UOA data tabulation, all 40 grades but likely all similar w/r to the anti-wear additives. You can see however I used Liquimoly MoS2 some times. Not sure if this gives you anything you were looking for but there are no meaningful differences in my data with a variety of Euro 40 grades over the last 6 years beyond repairs and a bad intake as well as track time.

Screenshot 2024-11-25 113341.webp
 
Check out my UOA data tabulation, all 40 grades but likely all similar w/r to the anti-wear additives. You can see however I used Liquimoly MoS2 some times. Not sure if this gives you anything you were looking for but there are no meaningful differences in my data with a variety of Euro 40 grades over the last 6 years beyond repairs and a bad intake as well as track time.

View attachment 251487
Thank you for that. It was helpful.

Your UOA's further illustrate an important concept:

Given a reasonable oil change interval, there is no meaningful difference in wear or long term outcome
of an engine as long as an oil that meets the required specs is used.

Oil brand, price, etc doesn't matter at all.
 
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