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  1. O

    No haggle pricing vs. Negotiating

    And this is exactly why things are the way they are. No honesty or transparency. (Not calling you dishonest or attacking you in any way ati)
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    No haggle pricing vs. Negotiating

    Here's another example: Why do many dealers charge almost $200 per hour for service labor? Why does the person actually doing the labor only make $20-40 of that? Why does that same person have to pay many thousands of dollars to furnish themselves with tools? Where does the rest of that ~$200...
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    No haggle pricing vs. Negotiating

    I feel like it's the industry you and I are in. Car sales have historically always been negotiable deals, and most people tell others they are dumb if they don't/didn't negotiate a better deal. Mechanic shops often mark up parts above what the customers themselves can get them for. If I sell...
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    Normal Idle Temps for 13700K?

    My original kit was a 12700K, Z690, and the H170i. Those parts went to build #2, and I bought a 13700K, Z790, and another H170i for build #1. All new parts. Interesting thought on the forced pump speed. I'll try it. I'm giving myself a complete refresh on overclocking. I can tune a GPU with...
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    Normal Idle Temps for 13700K?

    My primary build just got an upgrade a few weeks ago. I ended up with a 13700K, MSI Z790 Tomahawk DDR5, and a Corsair H170i (420mm) Elite LCD AIO with the ML140 fans. I used the factory installed thermal paste that was on the cooler, which Corsair claims is their XTM70. Everything I read about...
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    They are great boards. I now own two Z790 Tomahawks and one Z690 Tomahawk. Love the blackout look and love that they make things simple for those not as experienced (BIOS Flash drive included and ready to go). No stupid shark fins either. It takes maybe 10-20 minutes to get them fully...
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    Gotcha. Yes, the MOBO was positively new when I bought it. MSI doesn't seal their boxes :mad: but I'm an expert with identifying items that have been tampered with. I actually solved a case for GameStop last year when they had a rash of Samsung SSDs being returned in empty boxes. I had to solve...
  8. O

    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    Interesting. Call me dumb, but...why?
  9. O

    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    Not easily, but yes. However the answer has been found. See 3 posts up. Thanks for the input, it was correct.
  10. O

    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    Thanks for the suggestion. While this may be the case, I'm no electrical engineer. DIMM B2 is confirmed faulty, that's enough for MSI to do warranty work and figure out the rest. Good enough for me!
  11. O

    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    I'm great with paste. Less is more, to a point. I use MX-4, non-conductive. I use plastic gift cards and smooth out the thinnest layer imaginable, nowhere near enough to cover the entire chip. The paste is only there for surface imperfections, not to cool the chip. The more paste, the LESS heat...
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    So I don't think I need to swap the PSUs again. I think I have my answer. Between 3 different sets of RAM, regardless of stick A/B for each set, and regardless of XMP, DIMM B2 seems to be faulty. Obviously I'm doing it gently, but I can wiggle the other RAM stick a bit and no problem. If I...
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    Whoa, wait a second. Now we're getting somewhere! I disabled XMP with both sticks still inserted. Same artifacting. Then I removed the DIMM B2 slot... NO ARTIFACTING, no matter how hard I close the drawer. I inserted the RAM stick back into DIMM B2, artifacting again. I will try a few...
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    I will admit I forgot to update the UEFI. Software ignorance. However, I was on 7D32v18 and the update for Raptor Lake was 7D32v17. I now have the most recent update 7D32v1C. Still artifacts reliably. The lone SATA cable coming from the PSU has the Commander XT (PWM and RGB for accessory fans...
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    Agreed. Unfortunately even the bare essentials still allow the issue to persist. Now I've confirmed it is NOT the PSU, which was my highest suspect. Back to the drawing board.
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    I'm gonna have to rip the entire MOBO back out after the discovery in the above reply. FML. The RAM sticks are in DIMM A2 and DIMM B2. When looking from the outside, I am using slots 2 and 4 when labeling them slots 1-2-3-4 Left/Rear-->Right/Front. They are correct.
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    The MOBO standoffs are built into the case on the 4000D cases. All 8 screws are tight, and the center alignment pin (where the center screw would go) is correct. I really didn't want to undo my stellar cable management jobs, but I swapped it with build #2's PSU. Artifacting persists. Now I'm...
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    Interesting thought. I removed both sticks and installed a known good set. Same artifacting. So the RAM is not the issue.
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    I guess I'm not familiar with jumping pins on anything. Can you elaborate on this? This build is a bare minimum build. There are only 3 cables installed on the PSU and all are required to be connected. THe MOBO and CPU cables obviously, and the SATA is required for the AIO. The only thing I can...
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    3rd PC build, very strange issue. I'm out of tricks. Long read.

    No, it only has something along the lines of 'do not contact zones' on the rear. I've never touched the rear nor do I have anything behind it like cables, etc. I'll double check the standoffs and report back. Yes the MOBO is tight in the case, installed the same way as the previous case.
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